http://community.channel4.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/1766037851/m/36200087901

heated debate on here....im XNtrikalfaman for reasons only known to me....cossie lovers having a dig at the old fiat....

biggbn, that is NOT a heated debate. We've had a few corkers on different forums over the years, this one looks quite civilised.

I really don't see what the cossy does better on the road?

Did anyone see that harridan VBH driving the Focus RS against the Escort cossy on track? The cossy was miles faster, I was really surprised by this...

I don't trust VBH's tests. As for heated debate, where?

VBH?

v..... v.... vi..... visual bodily harm?

No, it's actually Visible Bum Hole, The next step after VPL.

Seems fair to me. I'd only have a problem with the guy who said the cossie was faster... wroooong.

a few posts were deleted to be honest...guy just cant accept that i lie the coop better than the ford....

Which poster are you then? The unpronouncable one?

What would you do? Buy a suped-up ford, or what is a Ferrari with a Fiat badge?

So deep down you do really want an expensive car that bankers drive.......... quoted so we can capture your comment forever............

That's the reverse of badge snobery isn't it? Badge snobery is buying a Coop and putting a Ferrari badge on it.

If I had £50K to spend I'd buy a new Nissan GTR not a Cayman.

If you had £50k, you couldn't afford to run a GTR mate. They're £60k anyway so out of your dream budget. Just concentrate on reality.

In all your posts you want to be "the man". Ferrari with a Fiat badge on? Ok then, if you say so!

I did own a coupe for nearly 4 years, I know what it is, and what it isnt FYI. Want me to post you some prancing horses?

LOL!

£57k for a gtr is worth it thou. Plus deprecation in a few years will make it worth it even more. That car is way above anything in that price range + another £50k by miles... I want one eventually

It looks as if there are enough people pointing out good things about the coop over there no need to get involved

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Coop was designed by PininFarina, built at Maranello, by hand by Ferrari mechanics, using a selection of Ferrari spare parts. But it was commissioned by Fiat so it has a Fiat badge. We could go on about Ferrari soul, but I'll keep the subjective out of it seeing as the passionate part of you has obviously died. I can smell your germin vermin infection spreading on you from here, it's on every word you speak. It's a disgusting lingering hum... I bet women have already started to turn away when you speak to them as if you have suddenly developed halitosis.

If you want to talk about 'Ferrari spirit', maybe you should try and explain away the Dino which is really only a Ferrari by badge and sh!teby any other definition?

Anyway, I'm not remotely interested in a classist badge, never have been, never will be. My Coop will keep it's Fiat badges so it annoys Porker drivers even more. I only prove my mettle. People who feel the need to advertise it, have to do so for a reason...

So, persist and I'll have you for Libel!

You're wrong. I'll correct you. Designed by Bangle.

Although......SHOCK! HORROR!! PROBE!!! CAPPO IN "I AGREE WITH WELFORMED ON SOMETHING" SHOCKER!

Yes, if I was car shopping with £50k in my bin, I'd buy a GTR too.

As above, it was designed by Chris Bangle whilst he worked at pininfarina, it was built at pininfarina's site at Grugliasco near Turin by pininfarina employees. But it was indeed commissioned by FIAT, has a FIAT badge, and FIAT mechanicals as used in other FIATs of the time (eg: engine in Marea)

As for the Dino, that was a favour done by FIAT for Ferrari to allow them to homologate the V6 engine designed in part by Enzo's son Alfredino for racing, and as a result produced the (Ferrari) Dino, the Fiat Dino and Lancia Stratos, all with the same engine, bar the name on the cam covers and other small differences (eg: carb jets) which supposedly allowed the "Ferrari" version to produce the most power (195bhp IIRC). At the time the Fiat Dino Coupe was compared favourably with the Porsche 911 (and was even more expensive than the 911).

I vote S1MMA and welformed have their own subforum. I would log on daily as this banter keeps me very amused at work.

I thought only the exterior was designed by Bangle whilst at PininFarina (same thing), and the interior by <someone not important enough to be named or a departmental collaboration> at PininFarina?

The parts bin thing is funny. Me and a mate who used to have an F355, play a spot-the-Ferrari-parts game. I got the indicator stalks in before he did.

I had no idea the legendarily great Stratos rally car and the legendarily crap Dino shared the same engine! WTF? I've seen a Stratos rallying in person and the sound awesome and go like stink. Also seen Dino's and you would never guess...

Yes true, the interior design was by pininfarina, I guess that's why we have the script on the dash Interesting parts bin comment, who's ever seen someone put FIAT badges on their Ferrari? *

IIRC the Stratos only had the 2.4 litre version whereas the (Ferrari) Dino and Fiat Dino came in 2 litre (aloy block with liners) and 2.4 litre (cast iron block)

But a lot of Stratoses (Strati?) you see these days are replicas with 2 litre FIAT twin cam or more usually 3 litre V6 Alfa engines in, the less careful replicas are easy to spot with 4 stud wheels instead of 5.




* Me Me Me - just look at all the recent Ferrari F1 cars

Yeah, ok then. Reality strikes again - no FWD small coupe based on a Tipo has a Ferrari spirit, the coupe raided the FIAT parts bin, not the Ferrari parts bin for most/all of it's mechanicals. I love the coupe for what it is, but you're trying to make out it's a lot more than it is. IT IS NOT A FERRARI by any stretch of the imagination. Don't worry though mate, I will probably buy a Ferrari in years to come, I just wonder what you'll make up in your head to hate me for then! I wonder what POS you'll be driving at that point also! I suppose you'll start comparing MR2's to F430 Scuderia's next!



The only person you annoy, is yourself. Because you hate what you see every time you look in the mirror. Why not change yourself before trying to take on the world chum - and lose all the hate around money? The expression: "Don't hate the player, hate the game" comes to mind everytime I see your attacks on people in cars worth 10 - 20 times the value of your own.............

But don't worry, I'll be here to keep you in check. Mate.

Erm I dont think Bangle Ever worked for PininFarina either. He worked at Fiat's Centrilo Style (sp) . Hence why there were two competing designs throughout development (Bangles and one from PininFarina) the PF design later went on to become the 406 coupe.

Fiat Centro Stile and Pininfanrina each put forward two designs, and none of them looked particularly like a 406 Coupe from what I remember....

Ooh Heathen! Haven't you changed! I only make the Ferrari claim in a playful way. I'm not serious you know...! I see your vermin disease spread far enough to affect your ability to be nice, as well as your perception of fun.

Just how many push-bikers have you ran over to force your way into that queue of traffic yet?

But seeing as you go down that route; I would've thought 'spirit' would come from the humans and human effort (spirit) making them, not the collection of cold hard mechanical components from some other mass-produced car? I mean, how does a lump of metal affect human soul? I guess you need to be a god believer for things like spirit and soul to stick though. Something you were supposed to grow out of those misconceptions as a kid. Maybe that's where all porker owners come from - making up for depressing unfulfilled childhoods? Continually being beaten (up) on level ground you have to cheat. That fccuk for capitalism eh!

And while I'm on about mass-produced tat designed to con the mundane out of their cash on superficialities like image, how is the Cayman? I have a question, how do porker owners keep count of all the raised middle fingers they get, I'm curious? Or do you just ignore the low-down dirty pocket-lining scum?

Why would I compare a mk3 Mr2 to an F430 when it's already critically acclaimed that would out-handle it, by supposition seeing as it's a more recent car but the mr2 is apparently second only to VX220-Elises, putting an F430 4th at best, by the likes of VBH, Needell, Plato... Clarkson... er, actually I take your point! Oh, not unless you're still confusing badge classism and snobbery, with substance and specifics of design again? Personally, it should be nice to know that you can use 100% of the cars power all the time as designed, than waste half of it most of the time... on a badge.



Ow. Actually <vain mode on> I kinda like what I see in the mirror. As I've been gradually 'improving the picture' at the gym and incrementing the notches on my bedpost that all say I'm yummie, I, somewhat disappointed-at-myself, get a bit stuck infront of mirrors, especially if I have my top off. A sad yet familiar admission, I know. But I thought that was just a happy male thing? Or maybe a shallow human thing to get too excited about shallow compliments that you know everyone gets?

Me change? Become a mindless self-serving lazy drone?! The type that is entirely responsible for the latest economic fccuk up, despite people like me saying it's coming, for example?* To lose that foresight and omniscience?! NEVER! (If because some want you to, that's the only reason people like me need not to. Jim Morrison would love me)

A lack of compliance is exactly what's needed to take on the world, if that were my cause. Mostly I just like taking the p and enjoying a bit of chest beating at others expense. No offence.

* also extended by 120 days. Expect house prices to now bottom out by mid 2012 not end 2011...

"In 1990 the development of the Coupé Fiat started. Paola Cantarella, recently named head of Fiat automotive division, assigns this job to two teams. The Centro Stilo, the design department which belongs to the company, and Pininfarina. Both of them are working on different configuration concepts.

Chris Bangle, under contract with Fiat from 1985 to 1992 and one of the leading designers, produces first extreme but trend-setting drafts for Centro Stile. Striking details like the corrugation on top of the wheel housing or the characteristic head-light covers are already apparent....

The first study of the Centro Stile is close to Bangles sketch. At the second study two different variations of the back have been at issue.

The drafts of Pininfarina appear rather classical and a bit apologetically intense, resemblance to the later Peugeot 406 Coupé (Debut in 1996) cannot be denied."

http://www.fiatcoupehistory.com/e_c1990a.htm

The second one looks like an Integra, dont think any of them particularly look like a 406. WTF is that other bangle one!

Welformed and S1MMA, pack it in. Go and have a wank or get laid or something. It's boring now you two always sniping at each other

Begbie is right and I was going to lock this one after this post, although as I’ve gone to all the effort of writing a reply and just seen it's been locked, it would be a shame to waste it:



Nice backtrack. My quote above holds you to your word though. Ferrari 20VT indeed.



None as of yet, although if some dellusional self inflated self proclaimed know it all like yourself got in my way, I would demolish them with glee (as I'm doing right now with you :))




Comes back to my point. Just because I (or anyone in an expensive car) has a shed load more cash than you, you have to justify it to yourself that they are rotten/immoral/users/etc… etc… you completely ignore the fact that there are people just like yourself that are simply more successful or work harder, and make more money. You hate this fact. You work for a corporate just like me, so don’t get on your high horse about stepping on people etc…



Money/player hating again eh? The Cayman is awesome thanks, it’s so much more than I ever dreamed it would be. It fills the gaps that I had in my old car, and has opened up a new world of RWD driving for me. You know what, I was expecting a lot of hate from people similar to yourself (you know - people who wish they could afford something more special than what they have but have little potential to achieve it – be it a Ferrari/Porsche/Aston whatever), with the middle fingers etc… but all I have had so far is positive comments. I chose the best colour that compliments the shape (IMO), and I’ve had people comment on how nice it looks, that they love the car etc… quite nice actually. The scum that lines my pockets isn’t low down or dirty, it’s actually the top end of society and corporates, but let’s not dwell on that – not everyone has to deal with scum. Another little pet hate of your life eh?



That’s it, pretending to be the people’s champion again. You’d take the better handling MR2 over an F430 scuderia now. Ok then. I read it as “I justify it to myself that the MR2 handles better than the F430, so it doesn’t matter that I can’t afford it, I wouldn’t really want one anyway. I also have a Ferrari 20VT so I have the Ferrari look covered”. Keep telling that to yourself mate. The truth looks a little bit different to the rest of us, but we’re all mad capitalists by your reckoning, so our view is immaterial.



Fit body, ladies man, vain, economic expert, Jesus Christ, I underestimated you Wellformed! If you made a bit of cash and bought that GTR you keep going on about, you’d be a force to be reckoned with! And you’d probably stop all this capitalist crap you keep going on about, stop the money/player hating, and get on with life.

Till that day…….

Topic locked as it’s gone a tad off topic. And Begbie locked it anyway……….

Beggers beat me to it.