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No claims bonus on two cars?
#184496
04/09/2006 20:15
04/09/2006 20:15
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Unfortunately ND wont insure the M3  which means I'll have to cancel the policy on the Fiat and start a new one on the M3. Given the M3 policy needs to start 5 days before the Fiat one ends, will I be alright with carrying my NCB to the new policy or will they consider this having NCB simultaneously on two cars, albeit for 5 days only.? Can any insurance experts let me know what the score is here.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184497
04/09/2006 22:14
04/09/2006 22:14
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,112
The clues in the name
DanTheManc
Competition Level
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Posts: 2,112
The clues in the name
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Will ND be willing to end the policy and send you the NCD for this year?
2000 Moony 20VT6
VXR
BMW 335i
BMW M135i
2017 Cupra 290 Black Edition
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184498
04/09/2006 22:29
04/09/2006 22:29
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Yes they will send it out within a day or so of me returning the certificate so it should be OK. Its just technically at the time of taking out the new policy, my NCB will be being used elsewhere. I guess this doesnt matter as by the time the new insurer asks for it I should have it from ND.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184499
04/09/2006 22:30
04/09/2006 22:30
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
S1MMA
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Competition Level
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
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the score is, you can usually only carry NCB from one policy to another. Usually insurers will not "match" your no claims on a new policy (so if you have built up a policy with 5 years NCD, and try to insure another car simultaneously, you have to start another policy at zero no claims).
Although, nowadays insurers are being a bit more flexible. I think it's direct line that will actually match your NCB on one policy to a new policy, so if you have 5 years NCD, and insure another car, that policy also will have 5 years NCD.
The problem I see you having is: you will have to run the coupe policy to the end to gain another years NCD (assuming you want another year on your history, i.e. you are below full NCD (or 5 years which is usually full)). So in a perfect world, if you can put the M3 in your garage for 5 days, then start a new policy with the new 1 year increased NCD, you've got the best result.
Would be a lot easier if your current insurer just temp insured the M3 for a week alongside your coupe. My insurer (Bell/Admiral) always add 2nd cars to my policy for fairly cheap, although they arent M3's!
Phone some insurers, speak to greenlight on here and see what he can do for you mate. Maybe he can sort you out a good deal. Insurers can always do favours for customers if they want to, it's at the underwriters discretion at the end of the day. If someone asks nicely enough and the request is reasonable I always consider it.
Sideways a LOT
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184500
04/09/2006 22:39
04/09/2006 22:39
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Quote:
The problem I see you having is: you will have to run the coupe policy to the end to gain another years NCD (assuming you want another year on your history, i.e. you are below full NCD (or 5 years which is usually full)). So in a perfect world, if you can put the M3 in your garage for 5 days, then start a new policy with the new 1 year increased NCD, you've got the best result.
Simma , I dont need the extra year, I have 8 years already. I need to start the new policy before I can end the one on the Coop as I actually need to drive both cars. No way around it.
Given the overlap is only 5 days . Is the insurer going to know the NCB is being used elsewhere? Is it stored somewhere they can see it.? If not then I should be OK.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184501
04/09/2006 22:49
04/09/2006 22:49
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
S1MMA
Competition Level
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Competition Level
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
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If you go to a completely new company, then they may ask you for proof of NCD soon after the policy starts. This will usually be some weeks after inception.
Only thing is, will the proof of NCD have on it when your last policy started and ended, because if it does then the insurer will be able to clearly see that you had 2 policies running at the same time.
Your best bet is to get the approval of the Underwriters that this is ok instead of chancing it - because if someone writes off or steals your M3 (and this is an M3 we are talking about, not a £4k coupe), they can potentially deny your claim due to this. A 5 day overlap is not much and I would not have a problem with it on the commercial lines that I write if a reasonable excuse was given. Underwriters are people, they will understand your problem - apart from the mean ones!
If the sales guy on the phone says they can't do it, ask for it to be referred to an UW, on mass market models the UWs don't see most of the cases, the models deal with them generally - so get it referred over to an UW to consider your request.
Sideways a LOT
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184502
04/09/2006 22:53
04/09/2006 22:53
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Cheers Simma 
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184503
04/09/2006 23:40
04/09/2006 23:40
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
S1MMA
Competition Level
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Competition Level
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
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no problemo, let us know how it develops.
Sideways a LOT
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184504
05/09/2006 05:57
05/09/2006 05:57
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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If you have (max) 8yrs ncb then cancelleing the current policy early wont matter to you. The current insurer must cancel on a pro rata basis as it is them who wont insure you new car. That means that you will get a small return from them. The policy wording will tell you that if your policy runs for 8 mths or more that they retain 100% of your premium - this is true but does not apply if it is them that will not insure your new vehicle.
You will need to cancel your current policy in order to use the ncb on the new policy - ensure that the dates are the same otherwise your new insurer will charge you for the number of days difference between the two dates ie: when your ncb becomes available to use. This premium, although only for a few days will be calculated on the gross premium (not incl the 8yrs ncb (60/65%)) and on an M3 with 0ncb that could be heafty.
If the underwriters are unwilling to help you could consider taking the ncb from the coupe policy on the date you start the m3 and pay the relevant extra for the 5 days that the coupe policy will run with nil ncb. It may not be much money and may be your best option if you need both cars on the road for that time.
Last edited by Mark20v; 05/09/2006 06:12.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184507
06/09/2006 01:32
06/09/2006 01:32
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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10yrs experience in this field  . Why should you lose out because the insurer wont cover your new vehicle, wont cover you in a particular area that you may have moved to etc. I have been out of it for a few years but know thats how it used to work. Short Period Cancellation rates are for each month or part thereof and the charges are not proportionate eg: 6mths cover is charged at more than the 50% of the annual premium - if you cancel it is heavily weighed in their favour. The other rate of cancellation is Pro Rata where they charge you per day based on your annual rate, effectively you pay a proportionate amount for the cover you have had. If the insurer wont write your business once you are with them they should cancel pro rata - this wont be in your policy wording so you will have to make them aware that you know this and that is what you are expecting. Any broker/intermediary worth his salt will confirm this and should arrange it with the insurer on your behalf. Most will/would have arranged the cancellation on a pro rata, advised the client that the policy was cancelled as per the policy wording (short period) and pocketed the difference between the two. Trust me, this happened alot. Regulatory bodies are more dynamic now however than they used to be but trust me, this happened.
Last edited by Mark20v; 06/09/2006 01:41.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184509
06/09/2006 03:35
06/09/2006 03:35
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Absolutely, as with most things it is goodwill. The point Im trying to get across is that it is something that is available to us but is not something that is advertised by the insurers. (For obvious reasons). I never came across a situation where a policy had to be cancelled where the insurer denied to indemnify following change of vehicles, addresses, additional drivers etc... where they did not agree to a pro rata cancellation rate. Each policy wording is different, most have short period cancellation rates published, some publish the pro rata cancellation rate in their policy wording. There is no set rule, only guidelines, normally weighed in the insurers favour but as they are eager to retain your business or regain your custom then generally will agree to it - goodwill, in a hope that you will return one day. Also note the calculated use of the word 'should' in the previous listings. 
Last edited by Mark20v; 06/09/2006 03:37.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184510
06/09/2006 03:50
06/09/2006 03:50
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
AndrewR
I AM a Coop
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I AM a Coop
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
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Cheers for the info, Mark - that's well worth knowing.
Dear monos, a secret truth.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184511
06/09/2006 03:58
06/09/2006 03:58
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184512
07/09/2006 05:11
07/09/2006 05:11
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Interesting stuff, Cheers Mark.
To be specific ND have said that I can expect a circa £220 refund from my initial £495 outlay. Seeing as I have only used 3months of the 12month policy this strikes me as being a bit unfair as they have refused to cover my new car, not because I have simply cancelled the policy. I have indicated to them that I would like a pro rata refund but we will see what they finally come up with.
The NCB overlap issue has now been resolved and I've taken a new policy out with Admiral on the M3.
Last edited by cosmograph; 07/09/2006 05:13.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184513
07/09/2006 16:14
07/09/2006 16:14
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
S1MMA
Competition Level
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Competition Level
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,033
I WANT F40
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Quote:
10yrs experience in this field . Why should you lose out because the insurer wont cover your new vehicle, wont cover you in a particular area that you may have moved to etc. I have been out of it for a few years but know thats how it used to work.
Short Period Cancellation rates are for each month or part thereof and the charges are not proportionate eg: 6mths cover is charged at more than the 50% of the annual premium - if you cancel it is heavily weighed in their favour.
The other rate of cancellation is Pro Rata where they charge you per day based on your annual rate, effectively you pay a proportionate amount for the cover you have had. If the insurer wont write your business once you are with them they should cancel pro rata - this wont be in your policy wording so you will have to make them aware that you know this and that is what you are expecting. Any broker/intermediary worth his salt will confirm this and should arrange it with the insurer on your behalf. Most will/would have arranged the cancellation on a pro rata, advised the client that the policy was cancelled as per the policy wording (short period) and pocketed the difference between the two. Trust me, this happened alot.
Regulatory bodies are more dynamic now however than they used to be but trust me, this happened.
I'm aware of what an insurance company can do, but there's a difference between that and what it will do.
As a broker or intermediary (which I'm assuming you were) you will carry a lot more clout with any insurer than a direct client. As seen above Cosmograph has been offered the lower quantum cancellation refund (non proportional), not the pro rate refund. If he argues this then maybe they will accept a pro rate refund, maybe they wont.
If Alexander Forbes approached me for an endorsement on a large commercial long term insured I would handle it differently than if a new business small direct client asked for the same service. I'm sure you will have experienced this yourself.
Bottom line, always fight for the best outcome but don't expect it. Not everyone will be offered the same service by differing insurers (or even the same insurer). You state in your later post that services are available but not advertised, this is a bit inaccurate - services are available but not offered to everyone.
Sideways a LOT
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184514
08/09/2006 01:23
08/09/2006 01:23
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Well, this seems to be developing into a battle - not interested in that - if my information is useful to anyone and saves someone some money then thats great.
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Re: No claims bonus on two cars?
#184515
08/09/2006 05:16
08/09/2006 05:16
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
AndrewR
I AM a Coop
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I AM a Coop
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
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I don't think anybody wants this to be a fight, but I think that on this part of the forum we have to be very clear when we're imparting information whether we're talking about the law or common practice (or even uncommon practice).
I think the information you've supplied, Mark, is very useful and I think you're a lot less likely to get ripped off by your broker if you know what you're talking about, but we still have to let people know that they can't bang their fist on the desk and demand their right to a pro rata refund.
Dear monos, a secret truth.
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