When a car is mapped, the results are based on different boost settings, to see how much power can be obtained.

Typically the level of boost that the car is left with is lower than the maximum boost setting. Numerous sensible reasons for this, including longevity, reliability, environmental conditions, fuel, etc.

But why do people quote the max power that was achieved with the higher boost setting, when the running car is on a lower boost setting / map.

Surely people must know that this isnt right, its kind of like saying "the car once achieved this" without then qualifying the rest of the state with "but now it only has this much <insert lower power figure here>".

I wonder why people dont want to admit what their cars currently run interms of power... rather than what was once achieved for a few seconds... never to be seen or experienced again...

(and before anyone gets paranoid, no this isnt aimed at anyone in particular, I havent read any recent mapping threads etc so i could tell you who has what length of whatsit at the moment)

Is there a question in the post then?

If you have a standard 20VT and someone asks you what power it has; do you say 220BHP or do you say well when it left the factory it should have had 220BHP, but there's no knowing how much it has lost since then... is it really any different?

Yeah there are plenty of headline hunters who are only interested in the top number that can be squeezed out of the car on the rollers. Personally for me it's all about having the most drivable amount of power you can get. I have a reasonably modified and I only ever say it has around 450 on high boost and 400 in everyday trim. the number isn't really important it is knowing it is tuned reasonably safely and that it will give you a suitable punch in the back when you press the pedal .

Agree with the last post, and I am sure this has been discussed elsewhere - my view is that engine top end power mods are quite low on the list of making a car more drivable (at least on the road but applies by degrees to track as well.

Good handling, sufficiently compliant for our excellent British roads (I kid you not, drive in the US for a month or so, and our roads are excellent - they clearly never had the benefit of Romans), strong brakes, and a reliable and cared for engine are the starting points for me.

When I wrote up what I have been doing with my greeny, there was a comment made on keeping it standard. I reckon this is a good plan, as servicing the suspension and steering, ensuring the brakes are well maintained, and looking after the engine actually makes for a mighty fine road tool

I guess for some people it's a macho thing, like my muscles are bigger than yours.

For others it's about finely tuning there car of choice and getting more enjoyment out of it... IMO

As said, it's about bragging rights. I guess it also matters when a modern day diesel hack can easily have 250hp, a coupe that's well fast blah blah with 280, 300 etc sounds a bit lame. Until experienced of course.

when anybody asks what my skyline is running my simple answer is PLENTY

You know that with EBC you can have preset a number of boost settings do you? I had 3 boost settings and for everyday driving I used 1.2 bar or 1.45 bar, winter/snow 0.8 bar and track high boost 1.45 bar all the way I see no reason why I shouldn't quote high boost bhp.

Exactly what I was going say, but couldn't be arsed to explain it!

Sure any car is capable of adjustable settings given the kit, but what makes the owner stick with a setting is typically due to safety and reliability.

Anyone can stick a car on the RR on a cool day and get it to the limits of the knock and wind it back a smidge and call it the max... but few would use that as an everyday setting.

So why quote the max that isnt used as everyday as the everyday quoted figure... as above, bragging rights must be up there in terms of the reasons.

On a road (and lets face it most of the cars are road cars with occasional track use) a car with more average torque across a wider rev band is likely to be a more tractable and faster car with 'better' part throttle response. We have seen many high power cars that are pants in road application because the turbo takes a while to spin up, at which point a torquey engine (with probably less max bhp) will be off and into the next gear.

The fascination with max bhp is amusing, it doesnt make for the fastest road car. Pub points sure. But who cares for a car that has nothing until 5k rpm then rips your face off till 8k? Fun, hell yeah. Practical (or fast and usable)in road form, no.

I'd quite like to see a meaningful chart that represents a cars tractability, and agility in a non 1/4 mile / drag / race scenario. Perhaps something that represented a cars 'power' under the curve. Average torque in the 'average' operating range - i.e. what most people consider to be the driving rev range.

A top trumps card deck for our cars

A bit impractical, but the braking and handling piece is far more important, at least for similar cars.

As a brief for example, at a Mallory open pit day last year, I was running an Alfa 33 16v. Standard engine and chip, only mod was a cold air induction kit.

Handling wise, new non performance shocks, slightly lowered springs front and back, thicker ARB at front, and 16inch wheels with Toyo Proxes. Braking wise, rear disk conversion and much larger front disks and calipers, plus Alfa 75 master cylinder (larger bore).

The difference? Could outbrake most other cars on the track into corners (particularly the hairpin), and carry a decent amount more cornering speed through all the corners, particularly Gerards and the Devil's Elbow.

Now, for sure the turbo kit was blasting past me at the end of the straight in a different league, but for other cars in a similar power league (I was around 130hp so comparing with twinny 155s and the occasional V6), the handling and braking, and a bit of track experience, was keeping me out front mostly!!

Im Certain that most "Mappers" only map to a safe level
I have a Gizzmo with 6 settings but i leave it on MAX so the top figure from the Rolling Road, could legitimately be quoted! doesn't mean i thrash it everywhere to be fair i very rarely do but when i do the acceleration is amazing
How many times have people ask you how fast your car is? what do you say? "well i did 73Mph so it will only do 73mph? mate"
Really, well your car is pants then "my fiesta can do 115mph"
The point is to gauge where the car slots in, in the grand scheme of things.
You would not buy a sports car if it wasnt fast you buy it for the passion prestige or fun
I agree with the original sentiments but the average bloke wants something to feel good about and also to justify the silly amount of money they have just spent..... no dear not spent anything!

I do and always will. It is also used. I have used lower setting befoe on the EBC, but it just gets tedious when you I don't get as much poke as I was expecting. Maybe if the top setting was silly high then I might, but I could always use less throttle...




Of course it's for bragging rights! I'd agree that I'd only quote the figure I use on the road though if asked...



This kind of statement always sounds like someone trying to justify having less power than other cars... Don't forget that a car that changes up at 8krpm rather than 7krpm will still be further up the rev range in the next gear...

I think these cars have come a log way in recent years and I've looked closely at dynos of the big power cars and they have a fair bit more poke at low rpms than you might expect. Sure, in relation to their top end power, it might look weedy but, in most cases, tehy still have as much power as a standard car...



Create one then. All you need to do is create a table with rpms and power. Use the gear lengths to create 5 (or 6) seperate columns and you can create a speed vs power chart with all 5 gears represented. Get really clever and you can reduce the power at speed by drag. I've done it many times with various cars and dyno plots to get an idea of how tractable is. Lag is difficult to simulate though...

Maybe, but im not in this as mine is standardish and certainly miles away from the properly modified cars.

Indeed, but this is only really good when youre keeping it in that band - typically when drag racing. Even keeping a standard engine and diff ratio in range on a track is difficult, let alone when an engine is working with a narrower and higher power band.



This is very true. When i started on classic minis the T3 turbos were capable of decent top end power but the lag was terrible. Now there are '1.5' hybrids that pull from nearly idle with very decent boost characteristics.