My opinion -

From someone who doesn't get a chance to use the Forum very much these days, I can see the argument for integrating the Forum and the Club as one, but the Forum needs the breadth of content that comes from keeping access free.

Paying membership which helps keep the Forum going seems an ok idea, except that unless there is something significant which is only available to members, then it could be questioned as to the value, since the majority get it free!

How you resolve that one I don't know.

As a member for several years I have attended the Christmas and summer club events and would continue to do so and these were something that you couldn't do in the same way locally. I think thses sort of things are still worth developing (along with other ideas) for Members.

Perhaps some suggestions based on what other clubs provide and take a poll?

Mark0904 - you have some good ideas there. I agree with everything you have said.

James

So do I james

I think something needs to be made clear here.

The Club FCCUK and the Forum Fiat Coupe Forum are not the same.

THE CLUB
Was run by Scooby, Bobbs, Kayjey and a board of several others, all of whome resigned recently.
Currently the club is being run by a group of nominated persons under the leadership of Begbie.
The new board are looking to make the club more accountable to its members with elected officials, club AGM etc.
A club run by the members for the members
The club has in the past supported the forum with donations from fees taken for club membership.


THE FORUM
Is currently being run by Kayjey, Bobbs, Scooby, and I beleive Nigel. The forum needs funding to survive so either the club continue to pay or the forum finds other ways to make money.

I think it should be left as it was with the club supporting the forum. I never really realised there was a difference till now. It was just kayjeys beautiful pink world

Like Paulw, and you Bob I have been a member for some time and attended Christmas and summer doo's and these have been great. Bobbs and Scooby put a lot of effort into organising these events. (Particularly enjoyed that Red Day at Donington)
(Oh, and the gents toilets in Harrogate ) Though I’ve never taken advantage of any discounts or anything as I never remember


I don't think the club is big enough to change. Doesn’t KJ mention 200 odd members somewhere in his post? Not a lot is it and for this reason I think Marks ideas, and a few others in a similar vein are flawed. Look at the other car clubs, Mini’s and Ford for instance and I think you'll find a much bigger membership. We would not raise enough numbers for a regular magazine or track day type events.

Membership supporting the forum is the way to go IMO. Though as Paul says, we need to have something significant that is available only to members, in order to attract numbers. Up to now we had free gift, window stickers, and summer and Christmas events. The last summer event was opened up to non-members due to lack of numbers and we haven’t had a Christmas event this year.

The one biggest thing that would increase membership numbers in my opinion would be to do away with the April to April membership period and allow members to join at any time for 12 month period. That shouldn’t be too hard to administer, surely one of them has got a computer

You could have a point C2D the Mini forum and the Focus forum look good but you are never going to attact that level of membership as there aren't enough Coupes.

Jim hits the nail on the head...

But isnt the smaller amount of members due to the fact it needs to be more enticing??

More exciting club = more members?

Theres 4715 members on here, and i know that every one of those isnt going to join, but....

I think its due to a number of reasons, not just one you can thing pin point:
It could be more enticing
It could offer more events
It could offer a magazine
It could offer track days
etc etc etc

But there will still be a large proportion of people who won't join it, as they don't wnat any of that, or will only join for a discount, but then will be dissappointed to learn that their money has subsidised the annual summer event and not a magazine.

I would imagine its very much a case of not being able to please all the people all the time

I think and agree with Bob above, their needs to be a greater definition between the club and the forum, the forum should be self funding, through either money from adverts, paying to sell your car and other items (how about a % on sales like ebay and even voluntary, may only be a few pence, but it will all add up) Then the forum can be left to run by Kayjey, the mods and with input from the club, but not run by the club.

I think the bluriness comes from everything in the past being run by Scooby & Bobbs, so there was no clear break between the 2, and not that that was a bad thing, but now it seems it is due a change.

For the club I have no idea what to do, as if its just purely the club and no forum funding, I doubt I would join again, as I have no need to.

In terms of the forum, I would suggest, bring back the donate button, try to encourage a % pay back on sales, pay for selling items, claw money through adverts, ask Mark to put a £1 on his book for each one sold, things like this.

Just some further thoughts from me

When I was in the VFR club there were several useful sections of their forum you couldn't access without joining, and the joining fee was a good deal lower so joining was a no brainer.

I think Club Members Only events, track days and rolling road days that are arranged and organised via the forum would be a great way of increasing members, the forum is the main way that the club gains exposure so giving people a little bit more incentive to join apart from the discount and small gifts would be a good idea. It would only involve adding another section and it would not isolate those who feel no need to join the club because they do not own a coupe anymore, as they could still join and enjoy benefits that dont only apply if you drive a coupe.

The coupe has a small enthusiast following but i think alot of interest is generated by the forum, it is a busy place as it functions not only as a technical site but a social portal as well, so people feel happy to be a part of it even if tuning and diy maintenance is not really their kind of thing.

If you dont like cars in the first place it would be unlikely that you would be here at all, so offering club benefits that would appeal to a wider range would certainly help dispel any worries that to much reliance is put on a hardcore few (who love coupes) to keep the club alive.

P.S: i think running the forum as a business could encounter difficulties and would put alot of strain on the people who run it and the moderators, alot more controls would have to be put in place if you are going to have fee paying customer displaying their goods on here.

^^^^^^^^^^^^

Great post.

Ross

Having not yet seen any club accounts we don’t yet know exactly what the club funded. There were no Christmas or summer events in the 2007 /08 membership year and yet the club has been handed over with no surplus of funds. We must therefore conclude that Christmas and Summer Events were not subsidised from funds.

There appears to be an urgency (From outside the Club) to get all this sorted quickly and start taking money off people. I personally am uncomfortable to start doing this until we know exactly where we are going, what we are providing and what any money taken is going to be spent on.

Since the formation of the separate club board communication between club and forum boards has not been easy. It has led to a lot of mistrust on both sides when in effect we are both trying to provide a similar goal, a club and forum for Fiat Coupé owners.

The new club board have been asking a lot of questions of the old board in an effort to try and find out where the club is at and indeed if it is worth spending any time and effort trying to save and keep it.

I am sure Keyjey is also extremely frustrated with the new club board. To him it appears that we are asking too many insignificant questions and dragging our heels with regard getting things in order, taking money and keeping the members on board.

agreed.

i also think its worth mentioning that IMO one of the reasons there is such a great community here is because the club is smaller than some of the other clubs mentioned.

in almost every newbie thread people metion what a great community we have, especially those coming from other larger clubs.

obviously the club needs fresh blood to survive, but i hope that any attempt to increase member numbers is carefully designed so as not to be detrimental to the community that makes fccuk what it is

^ agreed, regarding the club I would happily pay a membership fee for some organised track, RR and other events like AutoItalia.

Personally I don't think that social events should be paid for from club, I would rather pay separately for the ones I choose to attend.

From the forum, hopefully it would not change, except for a better system for verifying and charging professional sellers.

^Yep, exactly. A few events a year plus a couple of days such as Autoitalia, part of membership.

Then other events organised whereby we pay to go should we wish, some we may even get subsidies for for being a club, some may be social etc.

I called Brands hatch this week to ask if, as a car owners club, we could have our own designated area at something like the BTCC, and possibly small discount off of ticket prices for us as a club/group. Will report back what the outcome is. They sounded accomodating. We could then class this as a meet and a day out, paid for seperately hopefully with a discount ticket price or special arrangement

Another example - http://www.fiatracing.com - also called one of the organisers and mentioned us turning up to a raceday. Sounds like great fun and again potential to 'sort something out' for us as a club.

Just some examples

I think in many ways things would be far simpler if the club and forum just merge. Until recently even I as a mod didn't understand the separate structure.

This is understandable since the URL here is http://www.fiatcoupeclub.org (Fiat-Coupe-Club-UK) and not Fiat-Coupe-Forum-UK : http://www.fcfuk.org ....Ahh NOW I see why that URL wasn't chosen

So, who's in charge of this now? Begbie? Kayjey?



Yup I totally agree with this, but again this seems to be dragging on....



This is the bit that gets to me...lose the club frankly.



When was the last board meet? Do we need the club? Can't the forum just run like it does, with a member only section which would cover discount codes - trackdays - group buys etc etc. To me, this would seem the best option as we're going nowhere. Get the donate function back. Let Carl advertise/have his own section, he's suggested this god knows how many times yet nothing is done...

Having been around when James Northam ( some of you may remember him & Kayjey ),

I am always inspired by their efforts, they REALLY gave up a LOT, including personal affairs to help the FORUM & the club.

Personally, the amount I saved with Nigel & the manifold claim alone could have paid for the club for 5+ years.

I haven't renewed this year, simply cos I am lazy, but I do appreciate the hard work put by the minority & appreciate it.

Remember when the forum went down ?

How many seeked refuge in the FIATFORUM ( a great bunch by the way )....

you'll only appreicate this place when it's gone I'm fraid

Taz

Yes it could. But it would not be a non proffit undertaking like the club is



Taking money off Carl would be the simple solution. The ammount of funding Carl was talking about would actually cover ALL the forum costs and mean the forum could still be free to all.

You would then have the forum operated as a business and another business fully funding that forum. I am sure it could go this way if people wished.

Seems to me like you don't think too much of the community aspect of this place though if you are prepared to throw it away so easilly.

Is this a dig? Or should I take it as tongue in cheek?

Throw the community away?? I suggested losing the club - *not* the forum. All of the fellow owners I've met has been through the forum, not the club...

Why would the forum become a business? One tiny small section with my name on it, doesnt make the forum any different or a business. How does that change the forum so much?

Maybe if certain mods put their dislike of me aside things might move on.

And funnily enough carl isnt the only one to say/think this.

Ross

I think most people will see that as rather confusing.

Ive been here near 5 years i guess, maybe more?

To me the forum, here, is run by Nigel, Begbie, Kayjey etc etc

The Club, well doesnt really exist to me, there isnt anything i can see bar a few meets??? Wrong? I have always seen the club run by Scooby and Bobbs only, and only known moderators and certain users attending events. The club seems to me to be a circle of old friends, long term owners. Thats how it seems.


Its very confusing to say the least.

The member only section which offers discount codes is the club.

Only the club has the not for profit ethos, IE Run by members for members. That is not to say the forum is going to change into a money grabbing venture, just that it is already different, and is now more visibly split from the club



Carl you paying the Forum what you have offered would keep the forum open and fee free to everyone. This would be a great solution however one day you could decide you are fed up with Coupe and move on to pastures new. That needs to be taken into account.

The Forum / club would then be back to square 1.

And for the record I was not making any criticism of you, I don't know where you got that from!



The club was the front that took the money off members and used some of that money to pay for the forum fees. Like Peter said it was the club side that arranged discounts for MEMBERS at various outlets and the Club that arranged Two club events each year.

Does this mean that if the forum makes money, that royalties will be provided to people who have supplied how-to guides and technical advice?

Ross

Was i refering to anyone in particular? Im sure the few two faced individuals know who they are


Perhaps if people could also be bothered to involve me in any discussions things may be helped. Paying 1 year or 2 in advance would settle your concerns would it not?

I dunno, all the dosh the forum needs paid say 2 years in advance and a few personal prejudices hold things back. The offer wont stand forever.

I dont think this is the issue Carl, The forum is owned by Kayjey who can run it as he wishes, take advertising or not as he wishes.

The club would be run by its members, have AGM, votes etc, and be non profit making.

The forum is non profit making as well at the moment, but only because it cant actually generate a profit by itself, (in fact it was subsidised by Kayjays own pocket in the early years I believe). It now takes revenue from the club for running costs.

That is what the community comment is about, the club would be owned by the community (as I understand things) the forum wont be (probably). But its all very complicated and there is no clear direction for the club, because if the forum no longer needed the funding, what would the club actually be for?

Hench this thread

What club.

I really dont see anything. Its a membership for discount before you have a big bill at motormech or suchlike. What else is there??? The main reason people join the club is to get a discount on work. Or maybe just that feeling of being a member of something. The forum is the "club"

There was non or too little interest in past events, that kinda says it all.

No H2yper!

Thankfully this forum has written into the small print (Terms and Conditions) that you must own the copyright of any material you post and that you will always be responsible for all your posted content. You accepted these terms and conditions when you ticked the accept box as you registered.

This is a really positive thing about this place and to my mind one of the hidden virtues that makes it so much better than some other forum. Many of those other forums say explicitly in their T&Cs that all posted content (Other than images) becomes the property of the forum.