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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Jimbo]
#503813
16/12/2007 23:23
16/12/2007 23:23
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Jim - if you can find what Leda set it to that would be great. The problem I think I'm going to have is that Gaz can't do the tracking and setting up - so I'm going to have to be running about and spending money to get the setup right...
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#504001
17/12/2007 04:34
17/12/2007 04:34
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Yes. Sorting both rear arms has been on the to do list for a while... I've noticed some knocking going over bumps now - which I think is coming from the rear of the car. Would the stiffer damping or the suspension change in general be likely to cause this if the rear arm was worn (i.e. the arm is the issue)- was much worse when I stuck a 17 stone mate of mine in the passenger seat...
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#504440
18/12/2007 00:38
18/12/2007 00:38
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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How would I tell if the top mounts have been put on the wrong way round?
I've noticed that the thread on the damper is hitting the spring on both fronts - you can see where it's wearing.....hmmmmm.....
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Jimbo]
#504639
18/12/2007 15:11
18/12/2007 15:11
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sparco
Unregistered
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sparco
Unregistered
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Or just make adjustable top mounts and alleviate the problem altogether.
Madeno have this option and i'm sure there are pictures somewhere.
What i personally will be looking for is the best set-up not the most cost effective and what we have to accept is that in some situations things are just going to cost that bit more for the right solution.
Suba you are doing a grand job and if there is anything i can help with then let me know. Mind you i haven't been out in my car for a good few months now but it was running again at the weekend so very close now.
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#504643
18/12/2007 15:19
18/12/2007 15:19
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Thanks Marco - looks like the noise is actually coming from the front left, where the spring has moved off central from the top mount...
We'll see what Gaz have to say about the issues - but I'm also thinking a custom top mount that is up to the job in every way.
Thanks for the offer, but I'm not sure that there's anything that you can do mate. Just sit tight and keep an eye on the thread - I'll get there!
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Jimbo]
#504740
18/12/2007 17:05
18/12/2007 17:05
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#504794
18/12/2007 18:11
18/12/2007 18:11
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,729 N.E Scotland
mattB
Club member 6
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Club member 6
I AM a Coop
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,729
N.E Scotland
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I'd agree adjustable top mount is great. Much easier to set and adjust the camber than messing about with camber bolts or a slotted hole in the strut. Another thing might be to consider having a tender and main spring rather than a helper and main spring (if that's what you've got now and I've remembered them the correct way round ). I've considered changing to a tender spring but just never gotten round to it, but from what I've heard Jimbo say it sounds like a much better configuration.
Death-rattle-tastic
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: mattB]
#505142
19/12/2007 01:41
19/12/2007 01:41
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BMS
Unregistered
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BMS
Unregistered
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Having spoken with Gaz we will have to work on the seating of the spring to top mount. i believe the problem is due to lack of preload (need slightly shorter springs all round).
Anyone know coop factory caster setting? IIRC it should be 3.5 deg. we think at present camber problem is caused slight missalignment on bottom bracket). My logic behind using coop mount is i am sure it will deliver more caster than brava mount but i may be wrong. we could certainly go with adjustable top mounts but they do not last long - and I think this would put many people off?
certainly the second caster measurement in wrong. also i misread toe before there was a lot of toe out (2deg) ok on track but bad for tyres on road. the reason it was toeing out so much was due to the ride height being raised.
We are getting there an I thank Simon for his efforts.
Julian
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#505154
19/12/2007 01:58
19/12/2007 01:58
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,706 Gone
Jimbo
Je suis un Coupé
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Je suis un Coupé
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,706
Gone
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Just to let you know what I'm running Julian: Eibach ERS 6" 550Lbs/Inch Main Spring Part No. 0600.250.0550 Eibach ERS 250/550Lbs/Inch Progressive Tender Part No. 0200.250.0550 The top mount is using a seperate ball race bearing that fits inside the original top mount to locate the upper spring seat. Some pictures: Top Mount Bearing Upper Spring Seat Assembled Leda Strut Brava/o Top Mount Hope that helps ?
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Jimbo]
#505235
19/12/2007 04:15
19/12/2007 04:15
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Akeme
Unregistered
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Akeme
Unregistered
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Is that brava top mount in the picture fitted with KW v2s Jimbo?
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Begbie]
#505508
19/12/2007 18:39
19/12/2007 18:39
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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I think one of your rear trailing arms is starting to fail, hence the .11 you have on the rear left Nope - checked both of them. There is more play in the back right (which has neutral camber) - the rear arms are not causing any issues right now, or knocking noises etc.
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#505511
19/12/2007 18:42
19/12/2007 18:42
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296 Sandhurst
Begbie
ex El Presidente
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ex El Presidente
I AM a Coop
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296
Sandhurst
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it is the bearing in the arms that collapse. Both my rear wheels on my coupe have some serious negative camber, which killed my rear tyres in about 2k
Your car is Usain Bolt with wellies
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Begbie]
#506264
20/12/2007 21:06
20/12/2007 21:06
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Jimbo]
#506276
20/12/2007 21:23
20/12/2007 21:23
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Thanks Jim - all stuff that I'll pass on to balance and gaz....
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#509060
28/12/2007 00:34
28/12/2007 00:34
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Ok - my top mounts were definately the wrong way round (thanks Kenno for help with diagnosing on boxing day!) They are now the right way round, and the front left spring has been relocated (I'm fairly sure that Gaz did not locate it properly when they put the kit on). The camber issue on the front is most certainly caused by the ride height being too high, and the wishbne angle being wrong. Springs that are a good one and a half inches shorter all round should solve this....we're getting there!
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#539765
11/02/2008 17:46
11/02/2008 17:46
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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OK - some more work done on this. I've looked at the negative camber on one of the rears: http://www.fiatcoupeclub.org/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=539757#Post539757Gaz have sent me a set of new springs that are an inch shorter at the front and an inch and a half shorter at the back. The fronts went on yesterday. I had to grind one of the springs slightly to get it to sit right on the damper.... all fine now, but with the ride height adjuster at the bottom of the damper (lowers the ride height) the spring is too short to locate in the top mount - if I screw the adjuster up the damper so that the spring locates properly (1 inch travel) then I'm right back where I started in terms of the ride height, but just with a shorter spring..... I guess this is not so much of an issue when the spring is under load as I can adjust the coilover accordingly, however if I put it where I want it surely the spring would come out of its mounting if the suspension ever got to full droop - e.g. big pothole or front end leaving the ground?
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#539832
11/02/2008 19:08
11/02/2008 19:08
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sediciRich
Unregistered
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sediciRich
Unregistered
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Correct thats why most coil overs have tender springs so that in full droop they dont come away. Otherwise reduce the amount of droop - pretty sure I mentioned that way back, especially for the rears. Do you get the feeling that Gaz arent really hitting the mark on this job?
In hard cornering the inside wheel may experince large droop if the body rolls too much.
Rich
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#539845
11/02/2008 19:33
11/02/2008 19:33
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,729 N.E Scotland
mattB
Club member 6
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Club member 6
I AM a Coop
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 10,729
N.E Scotland
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Si, have they switched to proper coilover springs yet, like 60/65mm diameter ones or still using large diameter springs?
Death-rattle-tastic
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#539849
11/02/2008 19:51
11/02/2008 19:51
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Rich - there's no problem at the back - only the fronts. Thanks for the info - in case anyone else is wondering what a tender spring is then see: http://e30m3performance.com/tech_articles/susp-tech/springs/index.htmWith regard to Gaz they are putting stuff together based on what Julian at balance and I are telling them. Their manufacturing place does not have access to tracking kit etc. so all of that is up to me - and it's easier for me to fit the springs than to take the car to them. I have not paid a penny for the kit yet, so I really can't complain. I've had a go at dropping the front a touch without the springs coming away from the mounts - will go for a test later and see how it goes.
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Jimbo]
#540143
12/02/2008 02:42
12/02/2008 02:42
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sediciRich
Unregistered
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sediciRich
Unregistered
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They could use a proper spring, give the valving a wide range and allow the same kit to be available in a oroad or track application. Saving the OE top mount doesnt really save anything.
Suba can you get a tender to go at the lower end of the spring - you'll need a cup platform to keep it all in line.
Rich
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: Jimbo]
#540465
12/02/2008 19:41
12/02/2008 19:41
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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? Jimbo - you offering to 'fix' my car for me?
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#540469
12/02/2008 19:45
12/02/2008 19:45
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Rich - will ask Balance if this is on the cards, though as it is at the moment I dont see it being too much of a problem.
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Re: Gaz Coilovers - Prototype kit feedback
[Re: ]
#540478
12/02/2008 19:58
12/02/2008 19:58
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BMS
Unregistered
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BMS
Unregistered
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Hello all. again thanks for effort put into this Simon. I agree re coilover, tender and top mount so will put this into play - anyone got an old top mount lying about? thanks Julian
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