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Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: MeanRedSpider] #1577946
22/06/2016 22:45
22/06/2016 22:45
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 754
The South of the West
JonH Offline
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Posts: 754
The South of the West
Originally Posted By: MeanRedSpider
JonH - would you support Scottish and Welsh independence then?


Yes, of course.
Insofar as I would also support English and (Northern)Irish independance, as we are all equals in this British democracy.



No.199
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577947
22/06/2016 22:48
22/06/2016 22:48
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
M
MeanRedSpider Offline
Je suis un Coupé
MeanRedSpider  Offline
Je suis un Coupé
M

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
So you'd be happy with borders in those places and mostly those nationals being in Europe?

As for Ireland, they wanted nothing of the Commonwealth but are enthusiastic Europeans.

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577949
22/06/2016 22:51
22/06/2016 22:51

F
FreakinFreak
Unregistered
FreakinFreak
Unregistered
F



Speaking in caps-lock was deliberate, the only answer Leavers have is TAKE BACK CONTROL, over and over, just as Lynton Crosby has instructed them.

Last edited by FreakinFreak; 22/06/2016 22:52.
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577950
22/06/2016 22:57
22/06/2016 22:57

B
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
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Question:

Why was sturgeon on the in when she was on the out for Scotland? Same arguments about control, economy etc...

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: ] #1577952
22/06/2016 23:03
22/06/2016 23:03

G
GrahamL
Unregistered
GrahamL
Unregistered
G



Originally Posted By: Big_Muzzie
Question:

Why was sturgeon on the in when she was on the out for Scotland? Same arguments about control, economy etc...


Because she wants Scotland as far left and "progressive" as possible. "Out" for the Scottish referendum achieves that, as does "In" for the EU referendum, when compared to each alternative.

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: ] #1577955
22/06/2016 23:05
22/06/2016 23:05
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
M
MeanRedSpider Offline
Je suis un Coupé
MeanRedSpider  Offline
Je suis un Coupé
M

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
Originally Posted By: Big_Muzzie
Question:

Why was sturgeon on the in when she was on the out for Scotland? Same arguments about control, economy etc...


She was - but the argument doesn't necessarily work in both directions. If you believe that being in Europe gives you no sovereignty as the Brexiteers do, the logic follows that you need to allow Scotland its own sovereignty. But, if you believe that countries retain adequate sovereignty within Europe, having more of your own control makes sense. The fact that the EC has pushed more calls for independence around Europe (split of Belgium, Catalonia, Basques, Scotland etc) shows that potentially small nations feel like they will have more control as an independent part of Europe than part of a big nation.

Frankly I'd have some sympathy with another Scottish independence vote in event of a Brexit - and I'd get to vote too. And I was very anti in the last one.

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577956
22/06/2016 23:06
22/06/2016 23:06

B
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
B



Ah, never looked at it like that. Just saw her as Mary Mary...

Anyone watching the debate or lack of on Ch4?

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: MeanRedSpider] #1577957
22/06/2016 23:08
22/06/2016 23:08
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
magooagain Offline
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In the coupe.
Originally Posted By: MeanRedSpider
So you'd be happy with borders in those places and mostly those nationals being in Europe?

As for Ireland, they wanted nothing of the Commonwealth but are enthusiastic Europeans.





Do you mean Ireland or Northern Ireland?
If you meant Ireland,then it's not hard to understand them wanting nothing of the commonwealth due to who the commonwealth leader is.

Enthusiastic Europeans you say,well why not? They know they are a small island country and the help was offered.
Both hands grabbed it,to right I say.

Last edited by magooagain; 22/06/2016 23:09.


Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577958
22/06/2016 23:13
22/06/2016 23:13
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
M
MeanRedSpider Offline
Je suis un Coupé
MeanRedSpider  Offline
Je suis un Coupé
M

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
Why would Ireland be any different to many of the other Commonwealth countries who weren't particularly happy about being ruled by the UK?


Last edited by MeanRedSpider; 22/06/2016 23:14.
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: MeanRedSpider] #1577959
22/06/2016 23:23
22/06/2016 23:23
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
magooagain Offline
Club Member 259
magooagain  Offline
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Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
Originally Posted By: MeanRedSpider
Why would Ireland be any different to many of the other Commonwealth countries who weren't particularly happy about being ruled by the UK?





It was thier choice,and the choice was not to be part of it. If thier reasons were to do with past history with Britain then fair play to them.



Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577961
22/06/2016 23:23
22/06/2016 23:23

B
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
B



Same reason Scotland and Wales don't.... No one wants to be controlled by someone else. One man's good is another's bad.

They also f'in hate the English, like the Welsh and Scots...

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: magooagain] #1577963
22/06/2016 23:29
22/06/2016 23:29
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
M
MeanRedSpider Offline
Je suis un Coupé
MeanRedSpider  Offline
Je suis un Coupé
M

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
Originally Posted By: magooagain
Originally Posted By: MeanRedSpider
Why would Ireland be any different to many of the other Commonwealth countries who weren't particularly happy about being ruled by the UK?



It was thier choice,and the choice was not to be part of it. If thier reasons were to do with past history with Britain then fair play to them.


Of course. My point was to JonH: if the EU is so terrible and the Commonwealth so fabulous, why would Ireland be part of the former and not of the latter? I totally get that Ireland might not want to be part of the Commonwealth (though if the Brits had handled the Uprising better, history might have been very different) and I totally get why Ireland is in the EU. I'm just not sure JonH does.

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577964
22/06/2016 23:38
22/06/2016 23:38
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
magooagain Offline
Club Member 259
magooagain  Offline
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Forum is my life

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
As you can imagine I am for staying in Europe.
Won't I don't like about the out situation is that it seems to have brain washed people whose opinion is normally balanced.

They seem to have just jumped on the immigrant bandwagon and for some reason on social media they keep banging on about respect for our fallen soldiers and generally lovey dovey up to the royal family.

They have gone mad! Do they think that in voters don't respect others in any way?

It's like they have turned into moronic sheep!



Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: ] #1577970
23/06/2016 00:26
23/06/2016 00:26
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,595
angus, scotland
jimbob13 Offline
I need some sleep
jimbob13  Offline
I need some sleep

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,595
angus, scotland
Originally Posted By: Big_Muzzie
They also f'in hate the English, like the Welsh and Scots...


*45% of Scots...


[Linked Image]
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: jimbob13] #1577977
23/06/2016 07:34
23/06/2016 07:34

B
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
B



Originally Posted By: jimbob13
Originally Posted By: Big_Muzzie
They also f'in hate the English, like the Welsh and Scots...


*45% of Scots...


That's very true....

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: ] #1577978
23/06/2016 07:34
23/06/2016 07:34
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 33,568
Berlin
barnacle Offline
Club Member 18 - ex-Minister without Portfolio
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 33,568
Berlin
Originally Posted By: glenn1960
It would alo be nice if newspapers and news channels gave unbiased opinions . I have had the misfortune to have the ' mirror 'delivered every day [ thanks grandad ] and the coverage borders on the ridiculous.


I wonder why it is that the broadcasters are required by law and regulation to maintain a balanced reporting, with equal airtime for both parties, while the newspapers, in many cases owned by the same people as the newspapers, can spew bile and hatred about the viewpoint they don't like?


[Linked Image]
Don't get no respect! Coupe Fiat 1994-2000 - an owner's guide <-- clicky!
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: magooagain] #1577980
23/06/2016 07:39
23/06/2016 07:39

B
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
Big_Muzzie
Unregistered
B



Originally Posted By: magooagain
As you can imagine I am for staying in Europe.
Won't I don't like about the out situation is that it seems to have brain washed people whose opinion is normally balanced.

They seem to have just jumped on the immigrant bandwagon and for some reason on social media they keep banging on about respect for our fallen soldiers and generally lovey dovey up to the royal family.

They have gone mad! Do they think that in voters don't respect others in any way?

It's like they have turned into moronic sheep!


That's a very general and biased comment about approximately 50% of the population.

The in crowd are using the murder of an MP and mother for their gains on many forms of social media. Which is just as bad if not worse.

This is a balanced view of someone who may turn up and use ip dip do to select a box..... Cos I still don't feel I could vote either way with heart and head.

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577982
23/06/2016 07:52
23/06/2016 07:52
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
magooagain Offline
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magooagain  Offline
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Forum is my life

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
General view yes biased no. I just never mentioned the crap the IN crowd were giving out.

Honestly I am not voting. I can't see past the crap everywhere to get a true picture.

I suppose it's a cop out on my part. But living in a very insular part of the world for the past 14 years can make you not care to much.

I'm more worried that I have 5 gardens to mow twice a week in my spare time at the moment. Bloody grass won't stop growing.



Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: magooagain] #1577983
23/06/2016 07:59
23/06/2016 07:59
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 649
UK
Clintos Offline
Club member 2040
Clintos  Offline
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Originally Posted By: magooagain
As you can imagine I am for staying in Europe.
Won't I don't like about the out situation is that it seems to have brain washed people whose opinion is normally balanced.

They seem to have just jumped on the immigrant bandwagon and for some reason on social media they keep banging on about respect for our fallen soldiers and generally lovey dovey up to the royal family.

They have gone mad! Do they think that in voters don't respect others in any way?

It's like they have turned into moronic sheep!


How can you call anyone names for having an opinion?

The country is in ruins because of fools like you who didn't vote out 41 years ago. We have another chance here and Im taking mine........OUT!

The in voters seem to be the blinkered, I'm alright, it wont affect me types and sod the rest of the country and generations.

Think the out voters are far from being sheep and more the opposite, prepared to try something new and stop this country completely going down the sewer.

Based on that, I think you are the moronic sheep! loser

Last edited by Clintos; 23/06/2016 08:00.

Boooooooooost!!!
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: ] #1577984
23/06/2016 08:19
23/06/2016 08:19
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 649
UK
Clintos Offline
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Originally Posted By: FreakinFreak
Speaking in caps-lock was deliberate, the only answer Leavers have is TAKE BACK CONTROL, over and over, just as Lynton Crosby has instructed them.


TAKING CONTROL UNDERPINS EVERYTHING ELSE................CONTROL EVERYTHING FROM HUMAN RIGHTS LAWS TO IMMIGRATION AND WE DONT NEED TO PAY ANOTHER COUNTRY TO DECIDE WHAT WE CAN AND CANT DO..........SIMPLE!

COULD YOU IMAGINE AUSTRALIA PAYING JAPAN TO MAKE ITS DECISIONS......OR CANADA LISTENING TO AMERICA, NO BECAUSE ITS ABSURD

Last edited by Clintos; 23/06/2016 08:21.

Boooooooooost!!!
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Clintos] #1577986
23/06/2016 08:43
23/06/2016 08:43

J
Jonny
Unregistered
Jonny
Unregistered
J



Originally Posted By: Clintos
Originally Posted By: magooagain
As you can imagine I am for staying in Europe.
Won't I don't like about the out situation is that it seems to have brain washed people whose opinion is normally balanced.

They seem to have just jumped on the immigrant bandwagon and for some reason on social media they keep banging on about respect for our fallen soldiers and generally lovey dovey up to the royal family.

They have gone mad! Do they think that in voters don't respect others in any way?

It's like they have turned into moronic sheep!


How can you call anyone names for having an opinion?

The country is in ruins because of fools like you who didn't vote out 41 years ago. We have another chance here and Im taking mine........OUT!

The in voters seem to be the blinkered, I'm alright, it wont affect me types and sod the rest of the country and generations.

Think the out voters are far from being sheep and more the opposite, prepared to try something new and stop this country completely going down the sewer.

Based on that, I think you are the moronic sheep! loser


He's saying there are people out there who have made a decision without considering the issue fully or even at all apart from one or two issues. These people are affectionately called 'sheep'. These people can be found on both sides of the argument. Magooagain has made a decision based on various factors and certainly can't be called a sheep.

You also have not considered all the facts if you believe Britain is ruined. The only way you could say that is if the only indicator is how many 'foreigners' have come into the country over the years...

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: ] #1577987
23/06/2016 08:53
23/06/2016 08:53
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 649
UK
Clintos Offline
Club member 2040
Clintos  Offline
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UK
Originally Posted By: Jonny
Originally Posted By: Clintos
Originally Posted By: magooagain
As you can imagine I am for staying in Europe.
Won't I don't like about the out situation is that it seems to have brain washed people whose opinion is normally balanced.

They seem to have just jumped on the immigrant bandwagon and for some reason on social media they keep banging on about respect for our fallen soldiers and generally lovey dovey up to the royal family.

They have gone mad! Do they think that in voters don't respect others in any way?

It's like they have turned into moronic sheep!



How can you call anyone names for having an opinion?

The country is in ruins because of fools like you who didn't vote out 41 years ago. We have another chance here and Im taking mine........OUT!

The in voters seem to be the blinkered, I'm alright, it wont affect me types and sod the rest of the country and generations.

Think the out voters are far from being sheep and more the opposite, prepared to try something new and stop this country completely going down the sewer.

Based on that, I think you are the moronic sheep! loser


He's saying there are people out there who have made a decision without considering the issue fully or even at all apart from one or two issues. These people are affectionately called 'sheep'. These people can be found on both sides of the argument. Magooagain has made a decision based on various factors and certainly can't be called a sheep.

You also have not considered all the facts if you believe Britain is ruined. The only way you could say that is if the only indicator is how many 'foreigners' have come into the country over the years...


People on both sides can be called sheep and I beg to differ but magooagain did make a generalisation, which was my point. Im sure he can respond on his own too without someone else assuming they know what he/she meant.

How about the privatisation and destruction of every industry we once had, ship building, steel, coal, motor etc etc. Importing rather than making our own and that includes bringing in cheap labour rather than training our own. Not to mention the strain on the NHS due to immigration and what about fat cat bankers living outside the UK bleeding the country dry and avoiding paying into our tax system. See, Ive read and researched before making my decision but if Im a sheep then so be it wink
TEAM 'OUT'

Last edited by Clintos; 23/06/2016 08:56.

Boooooooooost!!!
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Clintos] #1577990
23/06/2016 09:18
23/06/2016 09:18

J
Jonny
Unregistered
Jonny
Unregistered
J



Originally Posted By: Clintos

How about the privatisation and destruction of every industry we once had, ship building, steel, coal, motor etc etc. Importing rather than making our own and that includes bringing in cheap labour rather than training our own. Not to mention the strain on the NHS due to immigration and what about fat cat bankers living outside the UK bleeding the country dry and avoiding paying into our tax system. See, Ive read and researched before making my decision but if Im a sheep then so be it wink
TEAM 'OUT'


I guessed that would be your answer bar privatisation, which I can't disagree with.

The loss to the economy from 'fat cat bankers' compared with your average man in the street fiddling the system is minuscule and not even worth the oxygen.

I'd like to see your figures that shows the issues with the NHS are due to immigration and not austerity/mismanagement/life expectancy etc.

I know of many businesses (real life, not the Tabloids) that have had to employ foreign workers because no one else wanted to do the work.

Using the EU as a scapegoat isn't the answer, it's a cop-out.

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: ] #1577991
23/06/2016 09:24
23/06/2016 09:24
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 649
UK
Clintos Offline
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Originally Posted By: Jonny
Originally Posted By: Clintos

How about the privatisation and destruction of every industry we once had, ship building, steel, coal, motor etc etc. Importing rather than making our own and that includes bringing in cheap labour rather than training our own. Not to mention the strain on the NHS due to immigration and what about fat cat bankers living outside the UK bleeding the country dry and avoiding paying into our tax system. See, Ive read and researched before making my decision but if Im a sheep then so be it wink
TEAM 'OUT'


I guessed that would be your answer bar privatisation, which I can't disagree with.

The loss to the economy from 'fat cat bankers' compared with your average man in the street fiddling the system is minuscule and not even worth the oxygen.

I'd like to see your figures that shows the issues with the NHS are due to immigration and not austerity/mismanagement/life expectancy etc.

I know of many businesses (real life, not the Tabloids) that have had to employ foreign workers because no one else wanted to do the work.

Using the EU as a scapegoat isn't the answer, it's a cop-out.


Well you have your chance today, my vote has already been cast via postal vote........OUT


Boooooooooost!!!
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Clintos] #1577992
23/06/2016 09:27
23/06/2016 09:27

G
glenn1960
Unregistered
glenn1960
Unregistered
G



Originally Posted By: Clintos
Originally Posted By: magooagain
As you can imagine I am for staying in Europe.
Won't I don't like about the out situation is that it seems to have brain washed people whose opinion is normally balanced.

They seem to have just jumped on the immigrant bandwagon and for some reason on social media they keep banging on about respect for our fallen soldiers and generally lovey dovey up to the royal family.

They have gone mad! Do they think that in voters don't respect others in any way?

It's like they have turned into moronic sheep!


How can you call anyone names for having an opinion?

The country is in ruins because of fools like you who didn't vote out 41 years ago. We have another chance here and Im taking mine........OUT!

The in voters seem to be the blinkered, I'm alright, it wont affect me types and sod the rest of the country and generations.

Think the out voters are far from being sheep and more the opposite, prepared to try something new and stop this country completely going down the sewer.

Based on that, I think you are the moronic sheep! loser
..... yes yes

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577994
23/06/2016 09:29
23/06/2016 09:29

F
FreakinFreak
Unregistered
FreakinFreak
Unregistered
F



Clintos, you may have done some research but have you understood what you've been reading. Privatisation has been driven by the same rightwing tranche of tory MPs that are now pushing for leaving. The NHS would collapse without using immigrant labour - since the tory's austerity measures stopped training where else are they going to come from? Not to mention 1.8m pensioners returning from Spain clogging up the wards. Those fat cats not paying tax are pro-brexit - Anthoney Bamford, chairman of JCB and Brexit posterboy is the most obvious example, but also Aaron Banks - brexit's biggest donor, the Barclay Brothers, etc.

You're actually a Remainer.

Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Theresa] #1577996
23/06/2016 09:31
23/06/2016 09:31
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UK
Clintos Offline
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No, definitely a leaver bye


Boooooooooost!!!
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Clintos] #1577997
23/06/2016 09:31
23/06/2016 09:31
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,833
Brisbane, Australia
Boosted7 Offline
My life on the forum
Boosted7  Offline
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Posts: 1,833
Brisbane, Australia
Originally Posted By: Clintos

Think the out voters are far from being sheep and more the opposite, prepared to try something new and stop this country completely going down the sewer.


I've heard this argument a fair bit over the past week or so. What concerns me is that some people seem to believe that the problems in this country can be fixed simply by "trying something new", having a bit of a "stab" or a "punt" at going it alone. Like somehow this will be the answer to everything despite there being a complete lack of evidence to support this being the case.

Leaving the EU is an irreversible decision. I just hope people ultimately vote based on a real understanding of the implications of leaving, and not simply based on some kind of emotional "whim", or sense of nationalist pride built around this false assertion that somehow our sovereignty and national identity are being destroyed by the EU.

Also I must say that the atmosphere of hostility that has been created towards immigrants during this campaign has been nothing short of disgraceful. As an immigrant myself (from outside the EU) with an immigrant EU wife, we've never felt so unwelcome in the 10 years we've lived here. It's a sad state of affairs indeed.


1998 Steel Grey 20V Turbo
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Clintos] #1577998
23/06/2016 09:34
23/06/2016 09:34

F
FreakinFreak
Unregistered
FreakinFreak
Unregistered
F



Originally Posted By: Clintos
No, definitely a leaver bye


Taken Leave of your senses maybe - your reasons point to Remain, but I guess for you its too late now.

Last edited by FreakinFreak; 23/06/2016 09:35.
Re: EU Fccuk Poll - In or Out [Re: Boosted7] #1577999
23/06/2016 09:35
23/06/2016 09:35
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 649
UK
Clintos Offline
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Originally Posted By: Boosted7
Originally Posted By: Clintos

Think the out voters are far from being sheep and more the opposite, prepared to try something new and stop this country completely going down the sewer.


I've heard this argument a fair bit over the past week or so. What concerns me is that some people seem to believe that the problems in this country can be fixed simply by "trying something new", having a bit of a "stab" or a "punt" at going it alone. Like somehow this will be the answer to everything despite there being a complete lack of evidence to support this being the case.

Leaving the EU is an irreversible decision. I just hope people ultimately vote based on a real understanding of the implications of leaving, and not simply based on some kind of emotional "whim", or sense of nationalist pride built around this false assertion that somehow our sovereignty and national identity are being destroyed by the EU.

Also I must say that the atmosphere of hostility that has been created towards immigrants during this campaign has been nothing short of disgraceful. As an immigrant myself (from outside the EU) with an immigrant EU wife, we've never felt so unwelcome in the 10 years we've lived here. It's a sad state of affairs indeed.




thank our leaders for not sending back the extremists who want to change our identity for that one. I fully understand why there is still and always will be racism in our country and there is no smoke without fire. We live in fear these days of being blown up or butchered on the streets by some extremist nutjob and we welcome millions with open arms...............turkey is about to join the Eu and then what?

Last edited by Clintos; 23/06/2016 09:36.

Boooooooooost!!!
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