1 registered members (carmine),
370
guests, and 2
spiders. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums69
Topics113,873
Posts1,343,464
Members1,596
|
Most Online731 Jan 14th, 2020
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1408540
03/02/2013 15:02
03/02/2013 15:02
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,614 Bucks
jame5
I need some sleep
|
I need some sleep
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,614
Bucks
|
Looks like an interesting day, good old Dyno Dynamics lottery! It would be great if everyone could post their graphs, gives a much better understanding of the performance than just peak figures.
James, was the boost level correct all the way to the limiter? If yes, then I would be looking to a transmission problem i.e. low pressue in tyres, binding brake etc, as the wheel power is low for your setup. That's the single biggest problem with the DD dyno, it doesn't give any clues to the problem. On my dyno it would measure the transmission losses so you would see a big discrepancy between wheel power and flywheel power (which would remain constant). We had a Focus ST in last month, first run it made 340bhp, second run it made 340bhp but wheel power was way down... the reason was a punctured tyre!
No boost levels as my vacuum hoses were secured with hoseclips and a slot head screwdriver wasn't immediately to hand they decided to do the run without boost readings I have noticed a little clutch slip on full boost occasionally but i would have thought that they would have noticed that on the run?
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: jame5]
#1408544
03/02/2013 15:19
03/02/2013 15:19
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,833 Haslemere, Surrey
Mark_S
Forum is my job
|
Forum is my job
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,833
Haslemere, Surrey
|
No boost levels as my vacuum hoses were secured with hoseclips and a slot head screwdriver wasn't immediately to hand they decided to do the run without boost readings I have noticed a little clutch slip on full boost occasionally but i would have thought that they would have noticed that on the run? Don't you carry a basic set of tools in your car?
Last edited by Begbie; 03/02/2013 16:35. Reason: Fixed quoting
997 C4S
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: jame5]
#1408548
03/02/2013 15:30
03/02/2013 15:30
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,673 SW London
Rudidudi
My life on the forum
|
My life on the forum
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,673
SW London
|
for a power run I wouldnt expect the RR operators to do any form of diagnostics. its a production line of roll on roll off and get your graph. For 35 quid each owner should make sure the car is ready, that's why you dont pay 250-500 quid ok maybe they could pick up on stuff, but i wouldnt expect that... else it turns into a workshop event were everyone wants things fixed as opposed to a rr shoot out...
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1408577
03/02/2013 16:56
03/02/2013 16:56
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 3,694 Midlands
MCMike
Club member 2095
|
Club member 2095
Forum is my job
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 3,694
Midlands
|
Great day :- 272 bhp 275 lbs/ft torque 1.2 bar unmapped and running on a 226,000 mile engine Biggenz & Barbz's cars were incredible, as was the Skyline I knew you were pushing 300bhp when you were on my bumper at brize norton airbase. But I did beat you with the bravo bloody close mind you. That was a great day at Brize Norton John, that Bravo was rapid. My boost on the Surrey RR was 1.2 bar at 3500 rpm, but had tailed away to 0.8 bar at 6000 rpm. Talking to Porky Paul today (and riding shotgun in his car at 1.35 bar !)I'm thinking maybe I should invest in a decent boost controller ?
1972 Triumph Stag 1984 Alfasud TI 1999 Fiat Coupe Turbo LE 2005 350Z
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: MCMike]
#1408589
03/02/2013 17:29
03/02/2013 17:29
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 3,694 Midlands
MCMike
Club member 2095
|
Club member 2095
Forum is my job
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 3,694
Midlands
|
My graphs :- would a boost controller hold boost longer ? Comments welcome
1972 Triumph Stag 1984 Alfasud TI 1999 Fiat Coupe Turbo LE 2005 350Z
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: MCMike]
#1408591
03/02/2013 17:34
03/02/2013 17:34
|
proccy
Unregistered
|
proccy
Unregistered
|
You have a ginger mullet............well you did say comments welcome
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408593
03/02/2013 17:49
03/02/2013 17:49
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 548 Oxford
Sean_C
Enjoying the ride
|
Enjoying the ride
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 548
Oxford
|
Here's mine. I got to say I'm broken by the HeartBreaker!! I have also scanned the last RR session graph at Owen Developments for comparison purposes. The plots of the two graphs are very similar right up to approx 5000 revs ,it's then the obvious differences occur.Dropping to 1 Bar of boost by 5500 revs didn't help, where I seem to remember at Owen's holding 1.3 BAR wasn't a problem.The Coop was still on a Novitec chip back then but has since been mapped by Flea. Im sorry, I still have not worked out how to link a photo properly even after all these years. If somebody would be kind enough ................... Oh yes, thanks to Gunzi for the organizing of course and always good to see/meet old/new faces.
Last edited by Begbie; 03/02/2013 18:12. Reason: Fixed the image tags
Enjoying Coop ownership, second time round . Also enjoying RWD action in a thundering V8 E90 M3.
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408602
03/02/2013 18:13
03/02/2013 18:13
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 548 Oxford
Sean_C
Enjoying the ride
|
Enjoying the ride
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 548
Oxford
|
The Nissan GTR was amazing!! Impressive stuff, as was Barbz' and Biggenz' Coops. Was good to meet you at last Pero.
Enjoying Coop ownership, second time round . Also enjoying RWD action in a thundering V8 E90 M3.
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Sean_C]
#1408615
03/02/2013 18:51
03/02/2013 18:51
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296 Sandhurst
Begbie
OP
ex El Presidente
|
OP
ex El Presidente
I AM a Coop
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296
Sandhurst
|
No worries, you can't use the image button but you need to use : [imgpop]http://www.abc.com/image1.jpg[/imgpop]
Your car is Usain Bolt with wellies
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: jame5]
#1408624
03/02/2013 19:09
03/02/2013 19:09
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,673 SW London
Rudidudi
My life on the forum
|
My life on the forum
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,673
SW London
|
I only had a socket set with me at the time and wasn't given any time to try and borrow a screwdriver, despite being in a workshop full of tool boxes. I didn't expect any diagnostics or anything fixed, just a couple of minutes to undo one hoseclip, not too much to ask. It sounds like i'm bitching after getting a low reading but i'm not, it's not their fault, they did what they were paid to do. I just felt a bit rushed in and out and a boost reading would really help figure out what the problem could be. hmmm, sounds a bit harsh, but i guess they are only interested in getting people on and off the rollers. at least now you know what needs looking at ....
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Rudidudi]
#1408626
03/02/2013 19:14
03/02/2013 19:14
|
tim42
Unregistered
|
tim42
Unregistered
|
I only had a socket set with me at the time and wasn't given any time to try and borrow a screwdriver, despite being in a workshop full of tool boxes. I didn't expect any diagnostics or anything fixed, just a couple of minutes to undo one hoseclip, not too much to ask. It sounds like i'm bitching after getting a low reading but i'm not, it's not their fault, they did what they were paid to do. I just felt a bit rushed in and out and a boost reading would really help figure out what the problem could be. hmmm, sounds a bit harsh, but i guess they are only interested in getting people on and off the rollers. at least now you know what needs looking at .... The guy (Charlie) spent some time after my run explaining to Barbz and myself what he thought were the issues... fair play to him. And he needed to manhandle some breezeblocks to keep Barbz' car on the rollers
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1408647
03/02/2013 19:50
03/02/2013 19:50
|
Barbz
Unregistered
|
Barbz
Unregistered
|
And he needed to manhandle some breezeblocks to keep Barbz' car on the rollers Been using Charlie coming on 9 years now and we've had some real heart stopping moments on his dyno. Proper power!
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Gunzi]
#1408691
03/02/2013 22:13
03/02/2013 22:13
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,614 Bucks
jame5
I need some sleep
|
I need some sleep
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,614
Bucks
|
Sean I wrote a step by step how to post an image, it's a sticky in the Coupe related chat section. As bet is has said it's all in the IMGPOP.
James, I think the issue you had was your running position. Charlie was saying around the time you ran his helper with the mo hawk was complaining that there were still ~9 runs left, which may go some way to explaining the rushed feeling you had. Fred was 2nd on the rollers and ran 317 rather than the 350 he was expecting charlie took the time to explain potential issues to look at.
I hope you can get it sorted and sorry you didn't get quite the experience others did.
One thing I can say is you won the award for most gleaming Coupe of the day, with Pero a very close second! Me, well when I got back I saw I'd missed a bit on my door when giving it a quick wash on Friday...! I did get the feeling they were getting a bit tired, to be fair i didn't see them take a break all day and there where still cars waiting after we left. I still enjoyed the day and thanks for organising everything. I would be happy to go back again when the cars sorted, i'll just make sure i get in first I have a few short video clips i'm trying to sort out at the moment, i'll post them up when i figure it all out (new camera) .
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408716
03/02/2013 23:56
03/02/2013 23:56
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296 Sandhurst
Begbie
OP
ex El Presidente
|
OP
ex El Presidente
I AM a Coop
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296
Sandhurst
|
I did get the feeling they were getting a bit tired, to be fair i didn't see them take a break all day and there where still cars waiting after we left Probably not helped by all the other non coupes running first
Your car is Usain Bolt with wellies
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Sean_C]
#1408737
04/02/2013 09:01
04/02/2013 09:01
|
Barbz
Unregistered
|
Barbz
Unregistered
|
Here's mine. I got to say I'm broken by the HeartBreaker!!
I have also scanned the last RR session graph at Owen Developments for comparison purposes.
The plots of the two graphs are very similar right up to approx 5000 revs ,it's then the obvious differences occur.Dropping to 1 Bar of boost by 5500 revs didn't help, where I seem to remember at Owen's holding 1.3 BAR wasn't a problem.The Coop was still on a Novitec chip back then but has since been mapped by Flea.
Im sorry, I still have not worked out how to link a photo properly even after all these years. If somebody would be kind enough ...................
Oh yes, thanks to Gunzi for the organizing of course and always good to see/meet old/new fact Your problem stems from the power sapping 10afr fuel mixture. So not the end of the world, an easy fix. Dont worry mate, i've had to settle for 485hp on the day as 0.25bar boost went walkies somewhere. But great day anyway, got to catch up with some old/new faces. Begbie's old 16vt was mighty impressive beast also.
Last edited by Barbz; 04/02/2013 09:02.
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1408739
04/02/2013 09:14
04/02/2013 09:14
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,829 kidderminster
nick_d
My life on the forum
|
My life on the forum
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,829
kidderminster
|
What is it with dynos, some cars go one and have no problem getting full boost, yet others its a lottery, mine NEVER gets to full boost on any of the 3 Dynos I've been on! 0.3 bar & 0.2 bar short both times been on dastek, 0.25 bar short on dyno jet!! Quite frustrating!! Nick
368bhp @ 1.5 bar
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408741
04/02/2013 09:18
04/02/2013 09:18
|
Biggenz
Unregistered
|
Biggenz
Unregistered
|
I've been very lucky in that respect. I normally hold full boost all the way to the redline, dyno or road. My turbo and wastegate combination seem to be working very well together. 2.15bar all the way to 8krpm in 4th on Saturday!
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408751
04/02/2013 10:27
04/02/2013 10:27
|
Nobby
Unregistered
|
Nobby
Unregistered
|
Good to see everyone. Some epic cars on show as always - never seen a GTR or GT3 on the dyno so thank for those chaps for bringing them. I'll definately bring the RS6 down for a dyno meet soon. Just need the bumper fixing and a remap - then to unleash 500+ bhp and 600 lbs/ft
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408758
04/02/2013 10:58
04/02/2013 10:58
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,728 London
kj16v
My life on the forum
|
My life on the forum
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,728
London
|
Hope you guys don't mind me posting here. Afterall, Dyno Dynamics rollers are supposed to be designed to be comparable to each other no matter where they are: I originally planned to go to the SRR meet but other commitments meant that I wasn't going to make it. So a few weeks ago I took a sneaky run on the Dyno Dynamics at Subaru 4 You in Newbury. Note it was actually run in the correct mode; Shoot 4F! VIDEOOriginal printout, from the Dyno Star dyno that I mapped the car on Observations: The DD didn't load the engine enough below 4000 rpm, resulting in the turbo spooling up more slowly than it would on the road. Hence the torque before 4500 rpm looking a lot lower than it should be. But peak torque and power are much closer. On the DD, the Coupe made 393 bhp / 380 lbsft @ 1.5 bar. Compared to 403 bhp/ 385 lbsft on the Dyno Star. Less than 3% difference - well within acceptable error considering different dyno, ramp rate, weather conditions, etc. Heart definitely not broken!
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408807
04/02/2013 15:22
04/02/2013 15:22
|
Deme
Unregistered
|
Deme
Unregistered
|
I'm back already as I'm meant to be on the way to a 60th birthday, but thought I would kick this off. My results are : 399.2bhp 385ft/lbs 1.35bar solid I'll let Barbz and Biggez say how much their hearts are broken Hey Buddy, Nice result! How come you are only running 1.35bar?
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408824
04/02/2013 16:47
04/02/2013 16:47
|
Deme
Unregistered
|
Deme
Unregistered
|
No idea, on the road it's always 1.5bar, but on the dyno it's less. I had this years ago pre engine blow up, used to run 1.4bar on the road, but only showed 1.2 on the dyno. Just finished scanning my graphs in as well. Ah I see! The loading on the car is different between the two perhaps. For instance my car makes more boost in the higher gears... Ps Thats a really steep power curve! Must feel awesome on the road!
|
|
|
Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Sedicivalvole]
#1408833
04/02/2013 17:36
04/02/2013 17:36
|
Barbz
Unregistered
|
Barbz
Unregistered
|
Your welcome!
|
|
|
|