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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408834
04/02/2013 17:42
04/02/2013 17:42
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Oi! I'll let Barbz and Biggez say how much their hearts are broken ![laugh laugh](/forum/images/graemlins/default/laugh.gif) The only 2 coupe's that comfortably breezed past 400hp on the day.. ![laugh laugh](/forum/images/graemlins/default/laugh.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1408835
04/02/2013 17:58
04/02/2013 17:58
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Biggenz
Unregistered
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Biggenz
Unregistered
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Oi! I'll let Barbz and Biggez say how much their hearts are broken ![laugh laugh](/forum/images/graemlins/default/laugh.gif) The only 2 coupe's that comfortably breezed past 400hp on the day.. Ahem. Only one Coupe breezed past 500bhp on the day. ![laugh laugh](/forum/images/graemlins/default/laugh.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408840
04/02/2013 18:21
04/02/2013 18:21
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,616 Aldershot
PeteP
Hon Club Member 005, Membership Secretary
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Hon Club Member 005, Membership Secretary
Forum Fossil
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,616
Aldershot
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Willies are only to be waved at dawn thanks. She may not be too happy either.
16VT and X1/9 1500
We must all do our part for the planet. I unplugged a row of electric cars that nobody was using.
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408855
04/02/2013 20:00
04/02/2013 20:00
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Biggenz
Unregistered
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Biggenz
Unregistered
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Funny you should say that. I know a Dawn. And I don't like to wake up at crack of Dawn.
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1408878
04/02/2013 21:22
04/02/2013 21:22
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Ahem. Only one Coupe breezed past 500bhp on the day Lol! ![laugh laugh](/forum/images/graemlins/default/laugh.gif) Aiding and abetting ![wink wink](/forum/images/graemlins/default/wink.gif)
Last edited by Barbz; 04/02/2013 21:49.
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408905
04/02/2013 23:11
04/02/2013 23:11
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johnnybravoturbo
Unregistered
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johnnybravoturbo
Unregistered
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Who got the most torque on the day?
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408917
04/02/2013 23:46
04/02/2013 23:46
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Kenno
Unregistered
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Kenno
Unregistered
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The GT-R, then me. ![wink wink](/forum/images/graemlins/default/wink.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408930
05/02/2013 00:27
05/02/2013 00:27
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johnnybravoturbo
Unregistered
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johnnybravoturbo
Unregistered
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Anyone take any videos of the Gtr? Was it new shape r35?
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1408945
05/02/2013 02:18
05/02/2013 02:18
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 548 Oxford
Sean_C
Enjoying the ride
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Enjoying the ride
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 548
Oxford
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Here's mine. I got to say I'm broken by the HeartBreaker!!
I have also scanned the last RR session graph at Owen Developments for comparison purposes.
The plots of the two graphs are very similar right up to approx 5000 revs ,it's then the obvious differences occur.Dropping to 1 Bar of boost by 5500 revs didn't help, where I seem to remember at Owen's holding 1.3 BAR wasn't a problem.The Coop was still on a Novitec chip back then but has since been mapped by Flea.
Im sorry, I still have not worked out how to link a photo properly even after all these years. If somebody would be kind enough ...................
Oh yes, thanks to Gunzi for the organizing of course and always good to see/meet old/new fact Your problem stems from the power sapping 10afr fuel mixture. ![shocked shocked](/forum/images/graemlins/default/shocked.gif) So not the end of the world, an easy fix. So what's the fix The Wise Old One?
Enjoying Coop ownership, second time round . Also enjoying RWD action in a thundering V8 E90 M3.
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Sean_C]
#1408966
05/02/2013 08:55
05/02/2013 08:55
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Call me and i'll sort it ![wink wink](/forum/images/graemlins/default/wink.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1408972
05/02/2013 09:09
05/02/2013 09:09
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,405 Castle Combe
Flea
Forum is my life
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Forum is my life
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,405
Castle Combe
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Here's mine. I got to say I'm broken by the HeartBreaker!!
I have also scanned the last RR session graph at Owen Developments for comparison purposes.
The plots of the two graphs are very similar right up to approx 5000 revs ,it's then the obvious differences occur.Dropping to 1 Bar of boost by 5500 revs didn't help, where I seem to remember at Owen's holding 1.3 BAR wasn't a problem.The Coop was still on a Novitec chip back then but has since been mapped by Flea.
Im sorry, I still have not worked out how to link a photo properly even after all these years. If somebody would be kind enough ...................
Oh yes, thanks to Gunzi for the organizing of course and always good to see/meet old/new fact Your problem stems from the power sapping 10afr fuel mixture. ![shocked shocked](/forum/images/graemlins/default/shocked.gif) So not the end of the world, an easy fix. So what's the fix The Wise Old One? The first step would be to let me check it on the road, as it has been four years this month since it was mapped, so potential for variances in engine components/sensors over that time. I have looked at your old logs and you are only running 0.3-0.4 AFR richer than I set it, so not a million miles out at all. We never had your Coupe on my dyno, so would be good to compare ![smile smile](/forum/images/graemlins/default/smile.gif) As for it having a power sapping 10 AFR, if you actually look at the graph you will see it only briefly touches 10.9 between 3.5-4.5k, but in all other areas it is averaging 11.1-11.2 and at peak power it is 11.4 so far from being power sapping!! There seems to be considerable lack of understanding regarding air fuel ratios on power/torque, something I will be addressing in detail later on. The main problem with your car is the lack of boost, if you compare your car to deannn_20vt, as you both have the same RSR turbo, you will see you have 0.25bar less boost pretty much all the way to the redline. That's a lot of pressure to be giving up!
Deann_20vt Sean_C
RPM
3.5k 1.4bar 1.4bar
4.5k 1.35bar 1.2bar
5.5k 1.3bar 1.05bar
6.5k 1.2bar 0.95bar
The main culprit for this is the wastegate actuator, therefore we should adjust the pre-load or replace for a 14psi actuator so that the correct level of boost can be used. I'll give you a call later Sean ![smile smile](/forum/images/graemlins/default/smile.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: nick_d]
#1408986
05/02/2013 10:15
05/02/2013 10:15
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,405 Castle Combe
Flea
Forum is my life
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Forum is my life
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,405
Castle Combe
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Just out of interest how much more power do you think both dean-20vt and Begbie would have got if they've have achieved the boost they get on the road... Dean-20vt's usually holds 1.4 to redline (1.2 @ redline on dyno) Begbies is normally 1.5 to redline (boost only got to 1.35 then held all the way)???? I reckon dean-20vt would have got to around 340 (from 322) & Begbie would have done atleast 420 (from 399), & prob 400 torques!! All speculation I know, but it seems Fleas Dastek is at MOST 5% out..... Although tim42's results are near identicle!! Nick Well Jack (deannn_20vt) didn't have his car on my dyno when I detuned it from 99 to 97 octane, although I don't think his does hold 1.4bar all the way from memory. As for Begbie, well I agree it would have seen another 20bhp and 15lbs/ft, well within the efficiency of the turbo. Tim's green Coupe now has a Stage 3 hybrid and all the usual bolt on mods, although I haven't mapped it so not sure how it has been setup. It certainly needs some attention as 1.55bar is way too much boost (and likely more on the road!), especially if AFR's are all over the place. Very unusual to have torque higher than bhp, and peak power at 5200rpm that never happens on a 20vt engine. The only time I ever really see this is if the engine is detonating badly at peak torque (cylinder pressures), so torque and power drop off a cliff.
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1408989
05/02/2013 10:26
05/02/2013 10:26
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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As for it having a power sapping 10 AFR, if you actually look at the graph you will see it only briefly touches 10.9 between 3.5-4.5k, but in all other areas it is averaging 11.1-11.2 and at peak power it is 11.4 so far from being power sapping!! There seems to be considerable lack of understanding regarding air fuel ratios on power/torque, something I will be addressing in detail later on. Here's an AFR table to help. Air/fuel mixture and characteristics 6.0 rich burn limit (fully warm engine) 9.0/10.0 black smoke/low power 11.5 approx rich best torque at wide-open throttle 12.0 safe best power at wide-open throttle 13.3 approx lean best torque 14.6 stoichiometric AFR (chemically ideal) <-- mean just enough fuel and air 15.5 lean cruise 16.5 usual best economy ![smile smile](/forum/images/graemlins/default/smile.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1408990
05/02/2013 10:32
05/02/2013 10:32
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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I'll give you a call later Sean Please contact Jamie5 and Stuart81 as they need your asisstance also. ![smile smile](/forum/images/graemlins/default/smile.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1408995
05/02/2013 11:05
05/02/2013 11:05
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1408999
05/02/2013 11:18
05/02/2013 11:18
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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All and well having great peak power figures but the journey to 500hp can be an interesting one. ![laugh laugh](/forum/images/graemlins/default/laugh.gif) Anyway, let's see your graphs
Last edited by Barbz; 05/02/2013 11:59.
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1409003
05/02/2013 11:27
05/02/2013 11:27
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Oops! Forgot legend. ![smile smile](/forum/images/graemlins/default/smile.gif) Biggenz - Green. PT6262 82ar (GT35 category) ![crazy crazy](/forum/images/graemlins/default/crazy.gif) 2.15bar Mine - Black. GTX3076 82ar 1.9bar
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1409004
05/02/2013 11:29
05/02/2013 11:29
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Scanned by a third party ![rofl rofl](/forum/images/graemlins/default/rofl.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1409005
05/02/2013 11:33
05/02/2013 11:33
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Interesting to note the GTR R35 air fuel ratios!
What you'd suspect from a remapped version i suppose? ![wink wink](/forum/images/graemlins/default/wink.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1409028
05/02/2013 13:32
05/02/2013 13:32
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 252 Oldham, Manchester
stuart81
Making a profit
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Making a profit
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 252
Oldham, Manchester
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Oh and we still seem to be missing a fair few graphs, come on chaps!! I'll scan my graphs when I get home tonight, mine wasn't holding boost so someone maybe able to shed light on what the issue maybe. It's also idling very strangely once hot (I'll post up a clip of what I mean).
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Begbie]
#1409050
05/02/2013 15:17
05/02/2013 15:17
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,486 London Tan
technics
I need some sleep
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I need some sleep
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,486
London Tan
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Lots of results missing guys cmon.
Someone should do a list, a bit like the attendees list then bhp and torque figures next to names.
Now in the 400+ bhp club!
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: Flea]
#1409051
05/02/2013 15:17
05/02/2013 15:17
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Interesting to note the GTR R35 air fuel ratios! If i spent 50k on a GTR R35 and my afr profile look like that, i'd send it back. ![rolleyes rolleyes](/forum/images/graemlins/default/grin.gif)
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Re: Surrey RR - 2nd Feb 2013 - Results
[Re: ]
#1409062
05/02/2013 16:52
05/02/2013 16:52
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Barbz
Unregistered
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Barbz
Unregistered
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All and well having great peak power figures but the journey to 500hp can be an interesting one On tarmac, both coupe's have unrelenting power deliver in every gear. Biggenz's has 1 main advantage due to the size of turbocharger, he's able to stretch the rpm threshold further in each gear by 1300rpm. ![laugh laugh](/forum/images/graemlins/default/laugh.gif) I make up the loss lower down for a more track focused setup. ![cool cool](/forum/images/graemlins/default/cool.gif) Horses for courses.. ![smile smile](/forum/images/graemlins/default/smile.gif)
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