Galactic core?

Bucky balls?

You can get cream for that, Stan

I really enjoyed this one, thanks, it did make me laugh that people are trying to make the government ignoring their advice to reform healthcare by using alien technology into a first amendment rights issue. I'm starting to suspect that the most vocal of the ufologists are actually brilliant satirists.

Anyway, that article led me on to this one - a description of the survey carried out to determine what percentage of the American population may have had alien abduction experiences that they don't remember.

Now while I'm only an amateur smart-arse on most matters, I am paid to understand surveys and the results they produce and, believe me, it's hard enough to get meaningful answers on subjects that you can't imagine anybody not remembering.

So, if you're trying to measure something pretty tangential and the results that come back are not just surprising, but completely loopy, i.e. that 33 million Americans have been secretly abducted by aliens, then you go back and re-examine your methodology, you don't make the assumption that you were right to begin with and excuse it away with alien magic...



My customers won't believe me when I tell them that their dog food is the nations favourite unless I provide tables of all of the results, verbatim copies of the questions asked, maybe even respondent-by-respondent data, with identifying information remove - but absolutely none of this stuff is present to support such an extraordinary result.

There is also the question of intellectual honesty; the questions used to profile 'abductees' looks a lot like the symptoms of sleep paralysis, which surely an MD would know.

We're still hitting the underlying problem that you can't seem to get away from - that you're treating people as credible because of academic qualifications they hold. Any qualification, from a GCSE to a PhD says nothing about the integrity or mental state of the person holding it.

As I've said before, scientific rigour works on the principle that nobody's word can be taken for anything; if somebody has a theory they have to prove it, if they've conducted an experiment then they must provide enough detail to allow others to repeat it, if they want to disseminate their ideas they do it through peer reviewed journals, where qualified members of their field can referee their claims.

If the UFO community can produce a peer reviewed article explaining how alien technology works, with repeatable experiments and samples of technology that has been shown to be alien then they'll be taken seriously. Because they can produce none of those things they are treated as nutters. What could be fairer?

Never gave this thread any real attention, but I've just spent quite some time reading through it, well most of it.... Very entertaining.

I've come to the conclusion that will clear everything up & will indeed answer a lot.

Jonny is an alien. Oh, & watch out he comes from Glasgow.

Two make this easier for joe bloggs on here!

We have 2 possible explainations - Firstly 'John smith' the patient walked across a splinter that happened to be a meteroite as it contains non terestrail isotopes so is from a galaxy far away. unique to this metorite a membrane that was containing the splinter which stopped the body reacting to it.

Furthermore the splinter emited varioius RF and upon removal RF singnal went away.

Even more startling, the splinter 'metorite' contained carbon nanotubes ' no other metorite ever found has contained carbon nanotubes'

The chances of above seem extermly unlikely and all backed up in the PDF.


The second explination John smith who claims to have been abducted throughout his life awakens after a strange encounter with pain in his toe and puncture wounds . Slightly disturbed by this John smith decides to reasearch and finds a surgeon DR Leir who has removed similar implants.

John smith then decides to go and visit Dr leir ,before xray the toe was placed under UV light and found to be flourecent green.

The xray of the toe was then carried out, the implant is spotted. Before being removed tests are carried out to check for RF which was found at different frequencys as the pdf explains. The membrane could not be cut with a surgeons knife upon removal and had to be dried out before he could get it off.

The implant is then sent for analysis to DR moser who confirms its non terestrial in origin, and has a carbon nano tube structure which is a manafactured feature.
The potential for Carbon nanotubes is well known and we do use them currently but at a basic level but in the future this technology will be used to increase strenght and superconductivity in various materials http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_nanotube

To conclude Moser then talks with Prof Kootz with his involment in the field of carbon nanotubes who backs up to two scientists claims and also samples the device with his more spezialsed equipment. As seen in the PDF.

What makes this even more strange Dr Leir has removed a total of 9 and is now seen as the specialist surgeon to remove the implants. All 9 have not yet been tested all have the membrane the other 2 that were tested showed carbon nano tubes.

So I ask the question what one of the 2 possiblitys is most likely?

If I woke up with puncture wounds and pain in my toe, I'd probably think about going to an ER as opposed to researching t'interweb.

I met an alien once. He was dressed in purple and had 3 weird creatures following him around worshipping the ground he walked on.

Since you directed us to that wiki entry on Carbon Nanotubes, alleging it supports your view that presense of carbon nanotubes is absolute evidence of little green men....



So, were the aliens knocking up swords several hundred years ago??

I just did some googling on your behalf matt. You wouldnt find Dr Leir even if you DID google your puncture wounds and toe pains UNLESS you mention the word ALIEN in your search.

1) non-terrestrial isotopes does not imply mega distances; as I pointed out, the sun is a Population 2 star and quite capable of generating those isotopes on its own. (Of course, this could be evidence of alien life, since it is unlikely that a Population 1 star would have sufficient heavy metals to form a planetary system). Alternatively, it is currently thought that there are large quantities of, um, rubble is perhaps the best word, not gravitationally attached to any particular star system, just to the galaxy as a whole. But local generation is the more likely - left-over stuff from when the solar system formed, or impact damage from the mess that made the asteroid belt.

2) No evidence beyond anecdotal has been presented that RF energy was being emitted. The experimental setup was undescribed, and particularly damning is the fact that all of the frequency bands claimed are in common and high-power use by humans worldwide.

3) No other meteor has presented carbon nanotubes? http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0012821X04003450
Additionally, there is evidence of interplanetary carbon nanotubes and buckyballs: http://www.sciencemag.org/content/237/4810/56.short

4) He claims to have been a repeated abductee, yet waits till now to complain? I'd love to see his library... other options: perhaps sleepwalking barefoot?

5) Glowing fluorescent green? You mean much as bacterial infections are known to do?


6) X-ray of the toe is hardly common treatment for a sore foot, but hey, if his HMO agrees or he has deep pockets, no problem there. But the object is simultaneously unable to be cut with the surgeon's knife (hint: have you tried cutting iron with steel?) and yet falls to bits in removal. It's not self-consistent.

7) Messrs Moser and Koontz conclude it is non-terrestrial (see my earlier post) but only by assuming alien interference as the only possible option. Carbon nanotube structures are found within the sample, as they are with other FeNi meteorites, so that must be aliens, then.

So in answer to your question, I too am going to appeal to authority: http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=192044, in which it is claimed that 40,000 tonnes of micrometeorites fall to earth each *year*. Those aliens are certainly busy little critters!

Once again, I beg to report that I am still not convinced. I would further remind you that as you're presenting the claim, the responsibility of proving it rests with you; extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. So far, nothing that is not explainable by terrestrial microbes and normal meteorite action.

In particular: where are the specimens? What is the power source? Why do they 'broadcast' on extremely well-used human bands? How do they transmit at ELF frequencies without an antenna miles long? What is the protocol for the radio testing? What testing was performed in the absence of the victim? And more...

Neil

Look up 'Wootz steel', Steve. It was famous for several hundred years and was thought to have worked because of the presence of particular species of plants used to create carbon in the steel. It's believed that it was also exported to Japan to make Samurai weapons.

Barnacle - I presume the meteorite you are refering to is the Tagish lake example which did show evidence of
'Buckyballs'
(which is described as a early stage carbon evoloution of the complex carbon in space)

The single structure carbon nano tube is a far more complex and space age technolghy and is also manafactured so is very useful as it employs semiconducting behaviors.

Single-walled nanotubes are likely candidates for miniaturizing electronics which would be likely in implant circuitry.

To answer your questions.

Dr Leir is holding all specimens as far as I am aware.

The power source is unknown however when removed from the patient it turns off (stops transmiting) which would suggest the power source is coming from the patient. Either in form of bio electric or vibration dynamics.

On digging a little more the objects emits RF @ 14.749650 MHZ.


As for the ELF its true to transmit you would need a large antenna but if we are dealing with far more advanced tech then it wouldnt be impossible.

As for the protocol I would emagine it would be alien proprietary lol

The only testing done with the patient is RF tests before removal. All other testing has so far been done by DR Maser & prof Kootz at different labs.

Just a little update DR leir now has 15 samples all with the membrane what would be the chances of the meteorite skelf ?

Jonny, I don't know which meteorite is in question; from reading the abstract (I'm too tight to fork out twenty quid to read the whole thing, I'm afraid) it implies multiple cases. It also includes the phrase 'They occur as discrete hollow and solid nanospheres and sparse nanotubes.' - sparse nanotubes being exactly what Koontz is claiming.

The 14.75MHz is all over the internet, but they all seem to be quoting each other. It is of course, slap in the middle of a band reserved for fixed and mobile communications, so it's reasonable to assume a terrestrial transmitter. By 'protocol' I meant 'how did they do the measurements; how did they exclude the possibility of interference etc.

For the ELF I'm afraid that even far more advanced tech it would still be impossible to couple an ELF signal without either a very large aerial, or a large aerial and a very powerful transmitter. I'm afraid I still think this is the military comms system they're hearing.

Its also very convenient that the aliens are leaving all these probes in peoples feet, give that Dr Leir is a Podiatrist.

One key issue not examined yet!

So how to we explain the protective membrane in all 15 cases?

Metorites dont have a protective membrane around them?

So even if you had the 1 in billion chance of skelfing yourself with a metorite they dont come with a membrane.

You have to admit 15 cases so far confirmed with the same anomonly is rather ilogical for the metorite theory


Directly from kootz pdf "Nanofibers, with a primary bundle diameter of approximately 10 nanometers (nm) were seen in both the sample outer coating material, and in the inclusions of light material in the dark areas of the sample (Figures 26-29). These nano-fibers resemble bundles of single-walled carbon nanotubes (SWCNT, Figures 30 and 31"

This is totally different from the 'buckyballs' seen in some but rare metorite examples as mentioned before.


All 3 scientists are far from finished with this plans and further testing ahead for this year helped with the dislosure project.

Away from the implant for now

I keep refering to the disclosure project which now has over 500 key whitness tesitomny

The disclosure project has a key insider whistleblower within congress and the obama document was created to make him aware as it seems, The whole ET operation is now funded directly without frontline goverment having any clue.

Just like the trillon dollars missing from the pentagon where do you think the money goes?
The obama document was personally handed to him by one of the projects congressmen.

http://www.disclosureproject.org/docs/obama/obama-briefing-introduction.pdf

I generally beleive every day as more truth comes out we will all be in for a massive shock and change in the very near future!

Price of fuel these days, they'd be better going elsewhere

Given the way we (Europeans, not Brits specifically) raped every country we "found" and plundered it's treasures and resources, usually enslaving, exterminating or contaminating the local populace, I think we should be eternally grateful that Alien life forms have treated Earth so well. Unless, as I suspect, they haven't visited yet.

I have no doubt there are other life forms out there, some way ahead, some way behind us (frightening though that idea is) in the evolutionary cycle. In the absence of what I consider to be proof (eg I meet them (and remember the meeting) or there is irrefutable photographic/video evidence supported by credible experts), I'll continue to believe that alien life forms have elected to give Earth a miss for the moment. I wouldn't expect the source of proof to be be Wikipedia, Youtube or available at cost on the Internet...

Nothing I've read on here has changed my mind.

Mind you I'm still waiting for my dad to turn up and prove that ghosts exist. Although it wouldn't be the first promise he broke...

Well, we don't know *what* it is... but so far we have no independent evidence that it is a protective membrane designed to avoid interference with the victim - indeed, in at least one - and presumable all - of these cases, they were found because this protection failed.

And that my friend is a typical debunkers response and you have just given a great example so thank you.

Dr Leir has removed implants from the Jaw,wrists,knees,feet& toes of patients. Not one of the implants was propertianly the same size but all have the assosiated membrane to protect the device and ones tested showed the carbon nanotubes with non terestrial isotope ratios.

So where does it leave us?

Truffle I would suggest you research any case fully before making the debunkers epic fail.

If this thread was for example based on a new cure for cancer there would be no taboo involved so a more serious approach would be taken. But as what we are discusing its taboo and become easy to laugh it off and employ a debunkers response which again I repeat is not to view evidence and make a pre determined comment or viewpoint which to be fair its not just yourself that employs.

I'm also slightly confused as to why we can create organic microprocessors and grow organs etc, and yet this alien race, who you've already said, are 100 million years more advanced than we are, are still relying on an metal 'implant'.

Infact Barnacle, only the 'john smith' case showed evidence of the object inserted caused infection probably caused by a third party . The membrane hadnt failed and when removed Dr leir couldnt cut through it with a surgeons knife as the bio membrane also has extermely tough caron nano structure he adv he can only get into it when its dried out.

Most of the others have remembered the encounter and got DR Leir to check and remove the implant without it showing sign of instalation or rejection.

Still banging our heads against that brick wall.

Simply because people point out the gaping holes in what you consider evidence doesn't mean they are debunkers. It means they are normal, reasoned, rational human beings that aren't so desperate to believe in something that they'll see evidence in any old shit posted on the internet.

Nothing, I repeat, *NOTHING* you have posted is proof of extraterrestrial visitors to earth.

It is a bio mechanical nano technolgy device. manytimes more advanced than an organic microprocessor lol

I never stated the aliens were 100 million years ahead of us again epic fail for you! lol

Prof Kootz stated the isotpes in the implants would need to come from a star system 100 million years before our own. Not that the alien race is 100million years adavnced.

I disagree

But *NOTHING* you have posted has disproved it has it. Instead you deployed tactics of taking the piss which has already been sorted out!

so if you have nothing constructive to add or to disprove then keep out. This thread must get under your skin which I find rather amusing as your clearly a debunker. So either man up and give evidence against/for or dont patricipate with comments to influnece the weaker minded.

Jonny, we've not debunked, but applied a little logic to the dozens of videos, testimonies, web-sites and whatever that you've posted here. Myself and others have generally put some thought into our replies and (excluding a couple of my posts) we've been civil about it.

There are, however, pretty much an endless number of web-sites and YouTube videos making crazy claims - are we going to work through them all one-by-one? Are you genuinely thinking, "Right, they've found holes in the last 50 links showing irrefutable proof of alien life, but number 51 is really going to make them accept"?

The truth is that, silly conspiracy theories aside, if there were genuine proof that could stand up to scientific rigour it would be the biggest thing ever. To know that we're not alone in the universe, to have the chance to meet with beings technologically ahead of us, to have access to the means for interstellar travel ... these would be the biggest things, ever. There isn't a person on the planet whose thoughts wouldn't be touched by this, one way or another.

But it's not real, and no amount of trying to convince yourself that you're above the common herd is going to make it real. It's a day-dream, and a pretty childish one at that.

Perhaps, with that in mind, you might like to show a little humility and not jump down someone's throat if that make what is, quite obviously, a joke.

It's obviously logically impossible to disprove that alien life has ever visited Earth, but if as we've done a pretty good job of showing that every single thing you've posted so far is nonsense the case isn't looking good for you, is it?

It is not the job of me or anyone else to disprove anything. If you're going to make a ridiculous statement such as aliens visit earth regularly then it is up to you to prove it and I repeat, *NOTHING* you have posted is proof whatsoever.

If I said I kept Bigfoot under my stairs as a pet I wouldn't expect you or anyone else to believe it even though you couldn't prove otherwise.

This term debunker obvioulsy holds a lot of weight for you. Why do you think most of the reasoned, level-headed people in the world are "debunkers?" What makes you think they want to be? They're just rational people who need genuine evidence, not bits of scrap pulled out of the toes of rednecks by a deranged, self-proclaimed doctor.

I would love it if aliens were genuinely visiting earth. I'd love it if it were proved possible. I think it would change the world for the better immeasurably if friendly aliens were proved to exist, but they're not and they can't.

You've had it explained to you many times by many people what constitutes genuine evidence and you just can't get it past the tin foil hat into your skull.

For the last time, they don't walk among us and probably never will. Get over it.

This thread seeems to have been extremly popular, but is now saturated with many different aspects of ufolgy.

I would consider myslef a intermediate in the level having studied it for at least 10 years so I do know most of the incidents .

I would be happy to review each case starting from the start not roswell lol! only to educate everyone on here where it all started and up to where we are today.

I could summarize 10-15 threads discussing important points in ufolgy, one thread at a time untill we conclude the evidence in a fair mannor?

Possibly the most sensible and impartial post on this thread.

As i come from Glasgow, am i also an alien?