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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449102
19/09/2013 18:44
19/09/2013 18:44
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783 In the coupe.
magooagain
Club Member 259
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Club Member 259
Forum is my life
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
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Worrying it is Dave. Hints in the thread are pointing to different facts than first explained by the OP.
Sounds like the civic lad said sorry and its my fault to the cat driver.
Its a reminder to us all to try and stay calm on track and dont let the red mist descend.
Cant help feeling sorry for civic boy though! (at the moment)
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: Hovedan]
#1449117
19/09/2013 20:53
19/09/2013 20:53
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Yes, we really do need the full story If it turns out that personal liability can be attributed to drivers for mistakes on track, it'd be the end of track days for me.
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449119
19/09/2013 21:12
19/09/2013 21:12
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dave_t
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dave_t
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Further worries ... although unsubstantiated (and I'm trying to find MSV T&Cs to see if it can be substantiated) ... There is a claim on the PH thread that MSV has changed its small print to include: "I shall reimburse MSV and other Relevant Persons against any loss or liability suffered by them as a result of my error, default, act or omission." if true
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449144
20/09/2013 05:50
20/09/2013 05:50
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783 In the coupe.
magooagain
Club Member 259
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Club Member 259
Forum is my life
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
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Was that small print for novice sessions Dave?
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449156
20/09/2013 07:23
20/09/2013 07:23
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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If that is true I just won't go with MSV......plenty of other companies out there.
On reading the pistonheads thread, it seems like the cateram driver claimed from his own insurance (Chaucer) and they then paid out, but went after the driver that hit him for all the costs..... And won.....nothing to do with MSV?
Difficult to comment without knowing all the facts on this case, so I won't do so.
But I quite like the idea that someone may now decide not to turn up in a 500 quid banger and drive like they don't care until they get kicked off, safe in the knowledge that they have no responsibility if they decide to do something really stupid and hurt someone. (Extreme example, but you get the idea.)
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: magooagain]
#1449159
20/09/2013 07:35
20/09/2013 07:35
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dave_t
Unregistered
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dave_t
Unregistered
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Was that small print for novice sessions Dave? To be honest, Joe, I don't know. That was just hearsay from the PH thread, and I've not been able to find MSVs track day T&Cs on the web. Si, you definitely have a point. Having said that I once had a very near miss with a 911 Turbo (he'd lost it out of a hairpin and was facing the wrong way on the track). It'd had only just happened, and the flags weren't out yet. I missed him, but not by much. I'd be bankrupt if I had hit him and something similar to this had happened!
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449174
20/09/2013 09:31
20/09/2013 09:31
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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I understand your point Dave - very daunting, but I guess the best way round that would be to make sure that you are nowhere near any high value cars, and either get well ahead of them, or let them go. Still does not get round it if there is a blind corner and you are 10-20 secs behind..... most of the people that are erratic or push a bit too hard seems to be the cheap car owners, or the expensive ones come to think of it.
I guess we've also got a solid reason to film our sessions now as well....!
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449191
20/09/2013 11:06
20/09/2013 11:06
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dave_t
Unregistered
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dave_t
Unregistered
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I guess we've also got a solid reason to film our sessions now as well....! That's an excellent point. I now just need to convince my wife that I'm buying two new GoPro's so that I can protect us from bankrupcy
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449195
20/09/2013 11:49
20/09/2013 11:49
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Jonny
Unregistered
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I guess we've also got a solid reason to film our sessions now as well....! That's an excellent point. I now just need to convince my wife that I'm buying two new GoPro's so that I can protect us from bankrupcy Yes I was thinking that. Bookatrack have contact Chaucer (the insurer who claimed) to find out the details.
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449196
20/09/2013 11:59
20/09/2013 11:59
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Carefull - there is a very obvious counter argument to that! "so you can't do any trackdays anymore, and now you have no use for the silly little car with no windscreen...."
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449201
20/09/2013 12:23
20/09/2013 12:23
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dazs78
Unregistered
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dazs78
Unregistered
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It does state in the PH thread that the court deemed all cctv footage irrelevant I was on track at donnington on monday just gone and i had a very close shave with a caterham that had spun infront of me where he very nearly came into the side of me. I wouldnt like to be in this position thats for sure.
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449215
20/09/2013 14:10
20/09/2013 14:10
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Carefull - there is a very obvious counter argument to that! "so you can't do any trackdays anymore, and now you have no use for the silly little car with no windscreen...." It's gone, replaced by a Clio It was going to be a stopgap before getting something with silly power in a few years time. We'll have to see how it pans out Might be back to a nice car for the road.
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449229
20/09/2013 16:23
20/09/2013 16:23
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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I know - I was replying to Dave T!
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449237
20/09/2013 16:44
20/09/2013 16:44
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Ahh But Dave needs his to commute
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449244
20/09/2013 17:33
20/09/2013 17:33
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suba
Unregistered
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suba
Unregistered
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Oh..... well if that's the case the excuse is watertight then!
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449249
20/09/2013 17:53
20/09/2013 17:53
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dave_t
Unregistered
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dave_t
Unregistered
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Ahh But Dave needs his to commute Indeed! But (fortunately) only whilst my Alfa had its chocolate gearbox sorted!
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1449250
20/09/2013 17:57
20/09/2013 17:57
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dave_t
Unregistered
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dave_t
Unregistered
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Carefull - there is a very obvious counter argument to that! "so you can't do any trackdays anymore, and now you have no use for the silly little car with no windscreen...." Surprisingly (or not) that is an oft-used sentence in my house! But I've managed to get the kids on-side They love trips out in 'Brum'
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1450063
26/09/2013 15:10
26/09/2013 15:10
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dave_t
Unregistered
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dave_t
Unregistered
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That's an interesting development, Joe. But I'm not sure it'd have much bearing on the situation on the PH thread. From the comments (from a lawyer?) there, there is nothing that can be written into T&Cs that can prevent you being sued if you are negligent. Essentially, there is no clause that can protect against negligence. And that sounds like a good thing, I think. Certainly, if someone was acting like a complete tool on a track day and wrote off my Westy, I'd think about pursuing a claim (in all honesty). The issue is 'what is negligence?' in terms of a track day. It seems (although not confirmed) that the guy being sued was deemed to be negligent as he was travelling too fast to take avoiding action. But that's the point of a track day! Driving hard round the blind right-hander Coppice at Donington is what it is all about! The worry is, that if you do that and then hit someone, you could be deemed negligent. And then be sued and lose a lot (potentially) ... I think it is this that needs to be cleared up ... but I've no idea how it will/ can be
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: Hovedan]
#1450080
26/09/2013 16:52
26/09/2013 16:52
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Jonny
Unregistered
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Jonny
Unregistered
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According to the thread, it appears the solution is a block third party insurance policy with the track day organiser. The norm in other countries apparently? Extra few quid on the cost of the day and fingers crossed this won't be an issue for us
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1450243
27/09/2013 14:00
27/09/2013 14:00
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Nobby
Unregistered
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Nobby
Unregistered
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Just to make things more complicated, where does the track owners obligation to keep the track safe come into things.
If you sign something to say 'I agree I cannot pursue any claims', then you go with oil on an otherwise dry track but no red flags etc... Who's fault is that?
Crashes must be fairly common ish, albeit minor ones. I'm suprised this hasn't come up before.
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Re: Track day crash ... court awards damages
[Re: ]
#1450252
27/09/2013 14:36
27/09/2013 14:36
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783 In the coupe.
magooagain
Club Member 259
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Club Member 259
Forum is my life
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,783
In the coupe.
|
I am on track tomorrow evning for a couple of hours here in France. The first since my new clutch and suspension.(Horaay) The cost is 60 Euros but as i dont have a track/circuit licence i have to pay an extra 22euros for some sort of insurance. I will find out more when i get there.
I will also have to show my mot cert,driving permit and my normal insurance documents.
I think all vehicles have to have an insurance of some sort.
I will try to get it all understood tomorrow night.
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