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#1620395 - 14/05/2018 08:48 stainless brake hoses install
hangar1138 Offline
Club member 1472
Making a profit

Registered: 10/04/2008
Posts: 244
Loc: Italy, Reggio Emilia
today in my local garage we jacked up the car to upgrade brake hoses with new stainless steel ones and also upgrade from dot4.1 to 5.1 brake fluid...

... but the problem (as usual) was at the corner !!

we cant unscrew the nuts of the old brake hoses, we tried with WD40 with heat gun we was near do deform the exagons and so we decided to stop and ask for support to UK guys...

how to safe unscrew??
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#1620396 - 14/05/2018 09:08 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
DaveG Offline
Club member 311
Forum is my life

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 7051
Loc: Lightwater, Surrey, UK
Try some proper "releasing fluid" like PlusGas or whatever you have locally. But you may have to accept that the hexagon end on the pipe is corroded and/or rounded off too much and you may need to just cut the pipe and put in a new section of pipe.

Also your old fluid is likely to be DOT 4 (not 4.1) and is compatible with DOT 5.1 (both glycol based) but do *not* use DOT 5 which is silicon based and not compatible.

PS: You are using the proper brake union / flare nut spanners like this are you?


Edited by DaveG (14/05/2018 09:11)
Edit Reason: Using correct spanners?
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#1620398 - 14/05/2018 09:25 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
hangar1138 Offline
Club member 1472
Making a profit

Registered: 10/04/2008
Posts: 244
Loc: Italy, Reggio Emilia
thanks DaveG

yes my mistake for DOT: from 4 to 5.1

and yes we have special spanners for brake hoses in the garage but also with them we have had to surrender

what means cut pipe? cut pipe, add new section with new nut and proper endforming and weld old and new pipe?
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#1620401 - 14/05/2018 09:45 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
DaveG Offline
Club member 311
Forum is my life

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 7051
Loc: Lightwater, Surrey, UK
Yes, cut pipe, and add a new pipe section with male/female connecting nuts (or "joiner section" with two female ends like this) and "flared" ends, but no welding. But you need the right tools to cut the old and new pipes and do the flaring too, plus new pipe and various nuts. I've never done it myself but seen it done and may need to do it soon since I'm doing the exact same job at the moment...
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#1620402 - 14/05/2018 10:05 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
hangar1138 Offline
Club member 1472
Making a profit

Registered: 10/04/2008
Posts: 244
Loc: Italy, Reggio Emilia
it's not far to what I do every day in my work but incredibly complex work only to do a simple maintinace to a car

can you confirm me please:

- diameter and material of the tube
- threads requested to male and female nuts
- can you post some pics of your work done or of your work in progress?

thank you
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#1620403 - 14/05/2018 10:08 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
RaumKlang Offline
Making a profit

Registered: 13/04/2013
Posts: 247
Loc: Germany
Have you tried some proper penetrating spray like Metaflux 70-05 Torsion Spray or 70-12 Rust Solvent?
I've managed to release corroded parts with these sprays that otherwise would have had to be cut or drilled out.
Especially 70-05 is rather expensive but works like a charm and combines a penetrating fluid with cooling spray. That way, it produces tiny little cracks between the corroded parts that help the fluid to penetrate.

There are other similar products like Caramba 661002, Presto 157233 or CRC 32720-AA Rost Flash Pro. All of them work by the same principle but I've found the Metaflux to do the best job even though it's twice as expensive.

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#1620404 - 14/05/2018 10:14 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
DaveG Offline
Club member 311
Forum is my life

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 7051
Loc: Lightwater, Surrey, UK
I'm afraid I don't know the pipe or nut sizes (although I expect them to be standard metric sizes) since replacing a section of pipe is something I "may" need to do, but hopefully not: all I've done so far is soak the fittings in release oil. As ever when you start having a look in detail underneath the car, other "opportunities" present themselves frown
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#1620408 - 14/05/2018 10:46 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
hangar1138 Offline
Club member 1472
Making a profit

Registered: 10/04/2008
Posts: 244
Loc: Italy, Reggio Emilia
thanks RaumKlang
interesing ...

where to find Metaflux 70-05?
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#1620417 - 14/05/2018 12:00 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
RaumKlang Offline
Making a profit

Registered: 13/04/2013
Posts: 247
Loc: Germany
Best bet is to contact them directly:
http://www.metaflux.de/eng/index.html

Or have a look on ebay for Metaflux 70-05. There's a guy selling some cans at 10,99 EUR plus shipping. I've just ordered four from him so he should have four left (he said he had 8).

https://www.ebay.de/itm/Torsions-Spray-f...353.m2763.l2649

I'm pretty sure shipping to bella Italia could be arranged, even though I don't know the guy.


Edited by RaumKlang (14/05/2018 12:02)

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#1620426 - 14/05/2018 13:21 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
GrahamL Offline
Forum is my job

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 3582
Loc: Pothole City
Rost Off Ice is another good freezer/release spray and fairly easy to find. Also nice for shrinking bearings/seals before fitting.

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#1620439 - 14/05/2018 16:23 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
szkom Offline
Forum is my job

Registered: 13/09/2009
Posts: 4625
Loc: ation
If flare nut spanners aren't undoing the brake unions, then you need to replace the solid brake lines. It suggests that they are too far corroded.

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#1620450 - 14/05/2018 20:25 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
hangar1138 Offline
Club member 1472
Making a profit

Registered: 10/04/2008
Posts: 244
Loc: Italy, Reggio Emilia
they don't seem to be corroded, they look in good conditions but I cant unscrew...

about the product Metaflux 70-05 I cant find it on ebay.it if I try ebay.de I find lots of results but no one deliver to "bella Italia" frown

I also found some german e-shops but with no english web page frown

why all sellers dont deliver in Italy? is this a dangerous or prohibited product??

I will seek advice of GrahamL and I will buy Rost Off Ice... from Germany ...
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#1620451 - 14/05/2018 20:28 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
hangar1138 Offline
Club member 1472
Making a profit

Registered: 10/04/2008
Posts: 244
Loc: Italy, Reggio Emilia
same german seller
METAFLUX 70-14 delivered in Italy
METAFLUX 70-05 not delivered in Italy

I dont know the differences between these 2 products
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#1620453 - 14/05/2018 20:55 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
RaumKlang Offline
Making a profit

Registered: 13/04/2013
Posts: 247
Loc: Germany
You want the 70-05. If it helps: I can order more from that guy I just bought four cans of and ship one or two to Italy. It might be handy to have a contact in Italy anyway as some parts for the Coupe seem to be available in Italy that we can't seem to get over here in Germany. If you have a few days to get the stuff, drop me a PM and we work something out.

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#1620505 - 16/05/2018 01:23 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
SVC Offline
Reaping the fruits

Registered: 22/01/2018
Posts: 55
Loc: Teresopolis
Cut the flexible pipe female to be replaced diagonally, with a Dremel, that round part, but very carefully to not do any damage at the inserted male of the rigid pipe.
At some point the male will be loose.
Use plenty of WD40 or similar spray lubricant at same time and keep trying to remove the male, gently.
It is a surgical method and must be done carefully.
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#1620526 - 17/05/2018 07:45 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
patrickstar Offline
Club member 1139
Enjoying the ride

Registered: 05/01/2012
Posts: 583
Loc: Stockport
I replaced all mine last week with 6 piece Hel , I also had the same issue on the off side rear. I ended up making a new section of hard pipe between the two stainless steel new sections , I ended up also buying a 11mm rachet brake spanner that also grips rounded edges, it worked a treat. would of been a right pain to replace the section to the compansater.

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#1620529 - 17/05/2018 09:18 Re: stainless brake hoses install [Re: hangar1138]
DaveG Offline
Club member 311
Forum is my life

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 7051
Loc: Lightwater, Surrey, UK
Well I failed to undo the o/s centre hose to rear pipe connection. Each end of the pipe that is clipped to the trailing arm has a short section 5-10mm leading in to the connector at each end that seems unprotected compared to the rest of the pipe (maybe it's an OE plastic coating that has "shrunk"?) Anyway, as I tried to undo the male connector, the pipe twisted and split, leaking brake fluid. Also the original rear braided hose pulled out of the male connector, leaving a "stub" behind. So the whole pipe will need to be replaced. Hopefully the centre hose to "axle" pipe (that leads from the rear compensator) connector will come apart OK...

I've never tried making up brake pipes, any pointers to some good kits? Hopefully including pipe cutter, flare maker, bend maker, piping and male connectors (and female, for making up repair sections?) Does everyone use Cunifer these days and not copper?
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1996 Portofino 20vt & 2000 Pearl White Plus
1985½ & 2016 2017 Fiat 124 Spider + XF Sportbrake

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