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Topic Options
#1609324 - 10/10/2017 17:57 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
I went from having the issue with the old plug to switching to the new plugs this weekend and still having the issue albeit not as severe. Plug 3 was in poor condition and coil pack 3 was split.

Replacement coil pack will be fitted tomorrow and go from there.

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#1609440 - 12/10/2017 08:30 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
Well she's still doing it, current list of tested, checked and replaced:

Tightened all boost pipes (nothing was loose)
Rewired green black cable on YCOD with bullets
Cleaned MAF sensor and sprayed with electrical contact cleaner
Unhooked as many connectors I could see and sprayed with electrical contact cleaner
Checked coil pack wiring, this was done a few years ago and it's all ok. Coil pack connectors sprayed with electrical contact cleaner.
Checked cam cover earth was tight
Checked elephants trunk which was unsplit
Reseated my GTEC 2
Cleaned inside of EBC solenoid with contact cleaner
Checked hard inlet pipe metal collar whose metal collars are in correct position
No boost splits for pipe just before inlet and just before inlet hard pipe
Replaced 24” battery negative strap with 12” item as per OEM length
Replaced 1 of the 2 fuel pump relays
Replaced spark plugs with Bosch FR6KTC
Replaced 1 x coil pack which was split

Jobs still to do:

Switch out boost controller to PRV
Switch out GTEC 2 to standard chip
Switch out other fuel pump relay
Run with no AFM connected
Soak AFM in contact cleaner
Bypass other YCOD cable
Check Fuel pipes in engine bay dry and tight
Breather hose deforming at high revs/pressure?
Compression test
Check wiring to starter motor / alternator
Check all fuses

Any other thoughts?


Edited by Gunzi (12/10/2017 14:22)
Edit Reason: More

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#1609447 - 12/10/2017 10:31 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Master_Mariner Offline
Club member 583
Making a profit

Registered: 16/09/2007
Posts: 370
Loc: Freedom
Is she still doing it, but not as bad/just as bad?

Someone more savy then me will have more insight- but if sounds like an electrical gremlin rather then anything else. Maybe in the wiring to the injectors on the plenum-or another area exposed to the heat of the engine? Hard to track I know.

It strange that its only at full revs though...

You certainly are doing the right thing in being as methodical as you can at trying to resolve this.

Random thoughts:

Fuel pipes in engine bay dry and tight?
Fuel pump giving up ghost/filter blockage of some type?
Breather hose deforming at high revs/pressure?
Good new/clean air filter in place?
No water into/issues affecting ecu?

Its interesting your getting it flat out...when everything else is at max stress.


MM

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#1609454 - 12/10/2017 12:54 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
Thanks MM, I will check all.

Air filter was replaced in 2014 with Apexi, and done about 6k since then. I'd hope it is not blocked yet!

ECU was dry when I reseated my GTEC 2.

I'll also get the other yellow connector of death cable bypassed.

A chap at my work has a compression testing kit so will give that a go next week whilst crossing fingers toes and every other part that is crossable.

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#1609461 - 12/10/2017 15:03 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
Forum veteran

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16843
Loc: Staffordshire
I'm clutching at straws a little now, but how old is your battery?
_________________________


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#1609464 - 12/10/2017 15:17 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
GrahamL Offline
I need some sleep

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pothole City
I'd swap out the airflow meter for a known good one rather than try any more cleaning. If it's dodgy then all the cleaning in the world won't help and sometimes too much cleaning can actually break them.

Also check your pipework where you removed the dump valve and sealed the holes, could be leaking there. Or re-fit the old dump valve + pipe if you still have it, just for testing.

May also be worth using cables ties to tightly secure the airflow meter and throttle position sensor connectors, just in case.


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#1609747 - 16/10/2017 13:27 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
OK I did nothing to the Coupe over the weekend as wanted it 'off' but today took a mate out to film the issue.

I have yet to work out how to link into Flikr, so here are the direct links which I bloody hope work!

https://flic.kr/p/Z6vooy

https://flic.kr/p/ZrsFe5

In short:

The boost drops from 17 psi to 9psi then shoots straight back to 17 psi.

The revs drop off the dial from 3.5 k to 1.0k before rising again to 3.5k.

So I'm thinking this could be linked to boost controller for the boost issue but I cant explain the rev gauge that is truly bizarre!

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#1609750 - 16/10/2017 13:38 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
H_R Offline
Club member 1114
My life on the forum

Registered: 30/07/2012
Posts: 1593
Loc: Dark side of the Moon
Electrical on the ignition side by the looks of the Rev counter engine won’t fluctuate that quickly

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#1609753 - 16/10/2017 14:00 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
GrahamL Offline
I need some sleep

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pothole City
Yes, that surely has to be an electrical rather than boost/mechanical issue.

Bad power or ground connection somewhere, or ignition switch fault or ECU fault maybe?

Have you cleaned and tightened all ground points? I'd also try wiggling the main engine loom connector behind the battery even just while the engine is idling, to see if anything happens. Maybe replace the rest of the coilpacks too, I wonder if a dodgy coil could be pulling down the supply voltage to the rest. And double check all the coil pack wiring again.

I have a spare reset ECU if you want to give that a try, just drop me a PM.

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#1609778 - 16/10/2017 19:16 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
Thanks for the input chaps this has changed the direction of my testing. Will give a few a try over the course of the week.

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#1609889 - 18/10/2017 13:39 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
I wiggled the cable behind the battery and also checked the loom which runs drivers side into the car for damage and the wiggle test. The car behaved normally so cutting out.

https://flic.kr/p/Za3BbN

I had previously checked the battery ground and the chassis ground which locates to the same point.

I recently replaced the battery negative cable and retained the original chassis earth cable which both go to the same point into the chassis. So it now looks like this, with 1 cable stacked on top of the other:

click to enlarge


Edited by Gunzi (18/10/2017 13:43)

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#1609894 - 18/10/2017 14:22 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
GrahamL Offline
I need some sleep

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pothole City
Pull and re-seat all the fuses and check around the fuse box and maxi fuses for heat damage or corrosion. Also check ECU socket and plug for water damage or corrosion if you didn't already.

Strange that it only happens on full boost... so is that a vibration/movement issue with dodgy wiring or an electrical problem with something cutting out at high load?

If you PM me your address I'll send you a spare ECU for testing, would be good to eliminate that before going hunting for wiring issues which could be just about anywhere.

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#1609897 - 18/10/2017 14:58 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
I found a melted fuse, green 30 amp behind the battery. Now replaced!

Will send you a PM, thanks Graham.

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#1609914 - 18/10/2017 17:38 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
GrahamL Offline
I need some sleep

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pothole City
Which 30 amp green fuse? The big maxi fuse in the small fuse box behind battery or the small 30 amp fuse in the pair with no cover?

Maxi fuse is the EFI fuse which supplies the ignition and ECU, the small one is just for the internal fan blower. Not uncommon for the small one to melt so my guess is it's that one and it's most likely not related to the power loss issue, but if it's the maxi fuse that's melted that might explain something!

I've sent the reset ECU now so hopefully that will at least help with diagnostics.

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#1609938 - 18/10/2017 21:18 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
It was the small 30 amp fuse in the pair with no cover and I did test it but yes you were correct I still have yes I still have the issue!

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#1610005 - 19/10/2017 16:25 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Master_Mariner Offline
Club member 583
Making a profit

Registered: 16/09/2007
Posts: 370
Loc: Freedom
Gunzi,

Was the car doing any of this this before you replaced the earth strap? If so when did it start doing it?

Had you done any work/had the car off road before hand?

Also- is your battery still locked in place on the tray?

Sounds like something -maybe small is loose/ moving around under that acceleration.

Wonder if a go pro would capture whats going on under the bonnet? You may see sparks fly...!

MM

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#1610023 - 19/10/2017 19:16 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
I also suspect this started to happen after I replaced the earth strap, but I’ve tried 2 different ones and it still does it.

That said the earth straps are stack on one another rather than going into the same connector.

Will double check the battery is secured.

The battery read 14.x volts during code reading so likely needs replacing.

All work is logged will dig it out and post up 2017.

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#1610033 - 19/10/2017 20:24 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Ballypete Online   content
Club Board member
Enjoying the ride

Registered: 02/02/2017
Posts: 421
Loc: Leics UK
I don't envy you with this one Chris- but just imagine the sense of achievement you are going to get when you finally get to the bottom of it!
_________________________
Doris the 1998 Portofino Blue 20V
Bog standard needn't be boring...

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#1610036 - 19/10/2017 20:31 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
Forum veteran

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16843
Loc: Staffordshire
A new suggestion

Run a separate earth strap from the battery to a new location somewhere on the engine and also to a new location on the chassis

As a temporary measure to test the theory, you could just use a decent jump lead. You should do these one at a time - battery to block first, then battery to chassis

Shame you're so far away - I could lend you a good set of coilpacks (I suppose I could always post them....)

Without reading back over two pages - have you had your ECU codes read?
_________________________


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#1610038 - 19/10/2017 20:46 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
Cheers Pete and Nigel.

Nigel good suggestion I’ll try the jump lead idea.

I got the codes read and had 1 code was:

(63) Lambda integrator FR upper limit

Thanks for the offer of coil packs. Will keep you posted.

Graham has sent me a spare ECU to try as well.

So tomorrow and Saturday it’s

Compression test
Switch ECU
Junp lead test

And cross fingers!

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#1610039 - 19/10/2017 20:48 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
GrahamL Offline
I need some sleep

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pothole City
Originally Posted By Gunzi
I also suspect this started to happen after I replaced the earth strap, but I’ve tried 2 different ones and it still does it.

That said the earth straps are stack on one another rather than going into the same connector.


That could be the problem, the original earth strap clamp is bolted down to fresh metal in the factory, if you've connected to the exposed side of the clamp or the exposed cable it'll be corroded and may not give a good low resistance connection and so might break down under high load.

Try cleaning up the connection point until it's shiny and getting the biggest/tightest clamp area against it that you can. Or just drill and tap a new hole for the new cable and secure with a new bolt.

Or maybe the new cable has a crap high resistance connection to the connector at the battery end... how does the actual cable join to the connector there, solder/weld, crimp or screw? And is it square and tight to the battery terminal?

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#1610092 - 20/10/2017 15:08 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Master_Mariner Offline
Club member 583
Making a profit

Registered: 16/09/2007
Posts: 370
Loc: Freedom
Your getting warmer Gunzi-keep going!!

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#1610094 - 20/10/2017 15:16 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
BBR Offline
Club member 1435 - Membership
My life on the forum

Registered: 15/05/2011
Posts: 1531
Loc: Hemel of the Hempstead
Originally Posted By Gunzi
And cross fingers!


keep them crossed, don't make them cross lol

teacher
_________________________
16v NA Blitz Blue

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#1610156 - 21/10/2017 13:12 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
Today I did the following:

Switched ECU with one from GrahamL (thank you!)
Replaced other yellow connector of death with spade connections
Checked the battery is secure
reseated every fuse under the bonnet and in the fuse box

click to enlarge

Went out for a drive and there was no difference the car still cut out exactly as per the earlier video.

When I got back inspected the earth strap to chassis connection. My observations were:

1) The battery earth strap was next to the chassis with the gearbox strap on top of the battery strap
2) The battery earth strap had red insulation tape which was sandwiched down by the gearbox chassis strap - slightly separating the 2 earth connections. Which you can just about make out from this photo:

click to enlarge



This was the red tape which shows it was being squashed:
click to enlarge


and after trimming:
click to enlarge

I cleaned up the chassis connection:

click to enlarge

This was the condition of the original gearbox to chassis connection:
click to enlarge

I sanded down all connections so they were shiny. It was reassembled with gearbox connection next to chassis and the battery to chassis on top of the that (opposite to when I removed it).

I ran out of time to take it for a drive however will test it tomorrow.


Edited by Gunzi (21/10/2017 13:17)

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#1610157 - 21/10/2017 13:19 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
So now the list looks like this:

Tightened all boost pipes (nothing was loose)
Rewired green black cable on YCOD with bullets
Cleaned MAF sensor and sprayed with electrical contact cleaner
Unhooked as many connectors I could see and sprayed with electrical contact cleaner
Checked coil pack wiring, this was done a few years ago and it's all ok. Coil pack connectors sprayed with electrical contact cleaner.
Checked cam cover earth was tight
Checked elephants trunk which was unsplit
Reseated my GTEC 2
Cleaned inside of EBC solenoid with contact cleaner
Checked hard inlet pipe metal collar whose metal collars are in correct position
No boost splits for pipe just before inlet and just before inlet hard pipe
Replaced 24” battery negative strap with 12” item as per OEM length
Replaced 1 of the 2 fuel pump relays
Replaced spark plugs with Bosch FR6KTC
Replaced 1 x coil pack which was split
Bypass other YCOD cable (connector now removed from car)
Check and reseat all fuses in engine bay and fuse box
Switched ECU (thanks GrahamL)
Rewire earth connections and trim excessive insulation

If the latest doesn't solve it then jobs still to do:

Switch out boost controller to PRV
Switch out GTEC 2 to standard chip
Switch out other fuel pump relay
Run with no AFM connected
Soak AFM in contact cleaner
Check Fuel pipes in engine bay dry and tight
Breather hose deforming at high revs/pressure?
Compression test
Check wiring to starter motor / alternator

Top
#1610158 - 21/10/2017 13:20 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
rayzer82 Offline
On a journey

Registered: 21/01/2010
Posts: 168
Loc: basingstoke, england
Good luck and fingers crossed...interesting to watch this unfold ...although I'm sure interesting is probably not the word you would use &#128565;

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#1610160 - 21/10/2017 13:23 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
Cheers rayzer82.

I am a patient chap, I know a number of other people who'd have stuck a hammer through the block by now laugh

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#1610162 - 21/10/2017 13:28 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Edinburgh Offline
Club member 225
Je suis un Coupé

Registered: 04/03/2007
Posts: 9921
Loc: Auld Reekie
Originally Posted By Gunzi

I am a patient chap


You're not kidding....

The rest of the world is watching smile
_________________________


So there, Photobucket...

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#1610172 - 21/10/2017 14:18 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
GrahamL Offline
I need some sleep

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 3444
Loc: Pothole City
Did you check the condition and tightness of the earth strap on the back of the engine near the bottom of the triangular bracket? Also the bottom bolt on that bracket has to be tight to make a good earth connection from the bracket to the engine.

Just that bottom bolt being missing (which isn't even directly part of the earth strap to bracket) can be enough to cause ECU failure and non-start.

You'll probably need to remove strut brace to get an arm down there, or maybe you can check it from below.

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#1610177 - 21/10/2017 14:39 Re: Sudden Power Loss on Full Throttle [Re: Gunzi]
Gunzi Offline
Club Member 189
Forum is my life

Registered: 30/08/2007
Posts: 6475
Loc: Southsea
I didn’t realise there was a connection down there.

I have minor oil leak I need to sort out and will remove the undertray to inspect so could kill two birds.

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