She's out ! (and now she's back in)

well as some of you know my engine blew a few week ago, i managed to source a 50,000 mile engine with full history for £200.

Now at the moment i really could not spare the cash to pay for an engine change so i thought i would attempt it myself.

Anyway after 14 hours of work over the space of 3 days ive managed to remove my engine, im very happy indeed.

Also i manged to remove the engine and gearbox by lifting it out the top instead of dropping it under the car, i think i may be one of the first to do this.

It lifted out very easy with no problems at all, the next step is fitting the new one when all my oil seals and other bits an bobs turn up from fiat.

Just thought id let everyone know as im well happy i managed it, and i would not have even got close without the help of Stan, and this forum, so thank you all.

Wish me luck fitting the new one.

Well done mate, hats off to doing such a big job on your own as well

Thats great news...... How the heck did you get the engine and gearbox out the top???? it must have had a hell of a tilt on it??

Good luck with fitting the new one, and hope to see you around soon as im at J28 so not far from you!
Matt

just to add it has taken only two of us to remove the engine, the other person being my 75year old grandad. He is a star !

the engine was on a fair tilt, if you position the lifting strap in a certain place it allows the whole engine and box to tilt at the perfect angle, it really did lift out easily.

Does this mean i wont get anymore phone calls now then James

Well done,hope the rest goes smoothly.Brave man for doing this!

nice one niff, keep at it mate

JBT maybe mate, wish i could have put the work your way but im out of work at the minute and really cant afford it, thanks for the help thow mate.

just a quick pic just after we lifted the lot out

Well done matey

Blimey! Kudos man!

OMG it looks like when you take a new piece of electronic equipment out of the box. You can see straight away it's never going fit back in there

Good job matey

As long as you haven't thrown away the polystyrene foam packing bits away!

Well done James and Grandad.

before we moved the engine out of the way to set it down we did see if we could put it back in as easy as it came out and it did, you just have to make sure you have the lifting strap secured in a way as to shift the weight to the box side. We also had a second strap fixed to the gear box so we could lift it up and level it before it lowered back in.

It really was lifted out within 5 mins.

Well done James and a big well done to your Grandad too

cheers T, lets hope everything goes back as easy as it came off lol.

Well done fella!!!

You should start up as a specialist after that one!!

i dont think so mate, it is really hard work, its not taken as long as i thought but its very hard.

If i had the spare cash i would have had jonnybravoturbo change it but i dont at the min.

Well done mate good luck with putting the new engine back in.

Great stuff Niff, really pleased for you....go for it brother

I am seriously impressed - having spent the morning fighting with the petrol tank straps, you're out of my league

Good work, very impressed with such effort and determination!

My good god that's a hell of an achievement!!!! Give your grandad a cuppa and a pat on the back from me nothing better than someone getting up and not using the excuse I'm too old!!

ill be getting him a good bottle of whiskey as he drinks about a bottle a night

when i had my tank lowered i used a jack with plenty of padding to lift and fix the tank back up.

and thanks for all the kind words people, like i said in another post it would not have been possible without the help from people on this forum, Jonnybravoturbo, stan, and possibly many more,

Cheers all.

Well done niff me old boy! A huge achievement for you and Grandad, and didn't even need me to make the trek to help.


I see I don't get a thanks for all my encouraging messages and offers to get in your way

Well done mate to you and your Grandpa . It's a pity that there weren't more owners like you who were prepared to get stuck in rather than break their Coops when the engine go boom .

Baz

I knew i forgot someone mate lol, thanks for the messages even thow the part were you put "thats the easy part" worried me a little, and i am grateful for the offer of you comin to help, not many people would have offered.

well done niff and your grandad thats some piece of work.

well the only thing i have done today is take the new engine from my house upto my ucles were im doing the swap.

The past few days have caught up with me and i feel ruff.

Going to have tomorrow off and then start the process of getting the new engine ready to go in.

Hoping to have it in for around wednesday of next week, ill keep you all posted.

Well done James,
Its always handy to throw yourself in the deep end and familiarise yourself with the car.Plus i am booked solid for the next 9 weeks i think now.

A few words of advice though.
When its all back in if you have the following problems.
Go to start and fans cut in but no starter(earth strap not connected to gearbox )
And if the code light stays on(connected O2 sensor to the code wiring,same style plug)

Also give me a bell when you come to refit the Ps pump....Its easier than it looks.
Well done though,
not an easy job.
You ll have to nip it by when its done...

cheers mate, i will be nipping it by once ive done, just for a good check over and also id like to have the underneath sealed aswell.

Thats as long as i do manage to get the new engine in and the car running.

Youll be fine Mate,just take your time and dont rush it.
Also switch your phone off.
Thats the cause of many problems.

well after spending most of today fitting the gearbox and new clutch i have finally dropped the new engine in and its on all the mounts including the gearbox mounts.

How chuffed am i to have managed this, it was pretty straight forward.

Just got to fit the powersteering pump, alternator, rad and then connect all the hoses up and the rest of the loom.

Also got to refill with all the fluids again but hopefully by the end of tomorrow i should be just about there.

well done matey, be proud - now lets all pray that it goes well and starts, and then runs well forever

fingers crossed mate.

Nice one bud!

Oh proccy, why'd you have to come bounding in and jinx it, other people's cars are allowed to run you know

nah i think i'm having everyone's bad luck right now, niff's will be great i'm sure - then we'll have another meet at chezvegas

Good going James,well done.

did not do much today as i had some appointments this afternoon.

I did have a couple of hours this morning, got the driveshafts fitted, fitted the gear selectors back onto the box and also re fitted the powersteering pump, pully, and pipes.

Just need to get the alternator on, rad and re fit exhaust, then sort the fluids out.

Should be about ready to start her up hopefully tomorrow.

Good luck Niffy, you are now very close to the end!

Just don't do what a good friend of mine did (and no, it wasn't me!), in his excitement at fitting a new engine all by himself, he meticulously filled it her up with coolant and started the engine.........having totally forgotten to put *any* oil in the blooming thing!

god thats shocking, ive got a list ive made up of things todo before even considering firing her up. Filling the engine with oil was one of those, after fitting a new oil filter, which i fitted today,

If i manage to find the time she should be done tomorrow afternoon.

Cheers stan

Well, it's nearly as bad as the brilliant, rebuilt engine I sold many years ago that was going into a bare-metal resprayed MGB (the engine was a Morris Marina 1.8TC, rebored to the max and ported etc etc).

Not only did I tell the buyer, a close friend of mine at the time, who also happened to be a mechanic, that the oil pressure sender wasn't fitted, but I wrote it down on a luggage label and tied it to the top of the engine.

You can guess what happened next.......he, at least, did remember to fill the engine with oil, and then started the engine up before discovering that his shiny engine bay (due to be seen all around the MG club scene) was now covered in engine oil.......oh how we laughed, eventually!

nice, i bet that took some time to get over, i just hope this new engine starts after all the time and effort put into fitting it.

Atleast i did have it running in the previous car before i bought it, also had the widget connected up too.

Fingers crossed anyway

Fingers crossed im sure it will be ok. It could go two ways, You could be celebrating over a or if it doesnt start
Honestly though youll be back on the road in no time.

hopefully it will be the pint option. Several pints, i deserve it .

to your tenacity mate. Good idea having a check list in case of last minute rush of blood and forgetting summat.

Well done Niff

Good work Niff, looking forward to seeing it at Chatsworth!!

been really bust today with other stuff but i did manage to sqeeze in a few hours tonight.

Only stuff left todo is fill engine with oil, fill gearbox with oil, fill power steering fluid, and fill with coolant.

And also re fit my widget as i took it out the car when i went to hear the new engine bofore i bought it, to check over any faults.

Really busy tomorrow aswell so it will be friday when i do this stuff, so hopefully friday afternoon she should be running and finished.

What a hard job it has been, but it will be worth it when i fire her back up.

4 hours and counting to start up ?

Well what can i say, filled all fluids up today, checked everything over then came to start and she would not kick in, spoke to jonnybravoturbo who suggested a few things, tried these and nothing.

So i went and picked JBT up and he came and had a check on the car with his diagnostic thingy, anyway it looks like my cam phase sensor is buggered.

So still no coop for me yet, i cant get over how off i am.

Many thanks thow to jonnybravoturbo for takin time out to come and look at my car, the guy is a star and i cant thank him enough, i owe him big time, cheers again JBT.

Now im off to cry

This is the error my widget has shown up:

You Entererd 8,177,4,28,71
Error Description : Cam Sensor

Binary Conversion of Field 2; 10110001

Number of engine starts since this error occured -7

short circuit from signal to battery positive, or signal over maximum range

important error for emissions - puts warning light on

failure has been memorised

sporadic errors

Now ive seen on another thread that the ECU can confuse the cam and crank sensor, is this possible?

Just to note JBT came up and plugged his SNAP ON computer into my car and it also showed the cam phase sensor fault, so will this cancel out the chance the ECU is confusing them as his machine also stated cam sensor?

i have no idea, all i can do is admire your tenacity and wish you all the best with it mate. i'm sure you'll soon be roaring round chezvegas again very soon...

Strange thing is i herd this engine running before it was removed. Seems strange that the cam sensor is now faulty. I have a few more things to try but it looks like a big ish bill if the cam sensor needs changing. One i Cant afford yet. An im not doing it myself.

maybe joe has one cheapish? gotta be worth a call or pm mate

Have you double-checked the connection to the cam phase sensor? On the 20v NA it is a real pig to reach, seeing as it is the (?Blue or white?) plug tucked underneath the plenum and right beside a knock sensor that is very similar. When I refitted the last engine I thought I'd got the connections perfect *but* the widget showed No1. knock sensor fault. Although the plug *looked* correct, it hadn't been pushed fully into place until it clicked locked.

It's worth a try. Similar with the crank sensor connections at the other end of the engine, but at least that is easier to reach and replace.....

cheers stan, jonnybravoturbo came up yesterday and we checked all the connections. Ive cancelled out the crank sensor and cam sensor being confused by the ecu as i disconnected the crank sensor and it then came up on the widget.

Ive asked JBT to fit it in at his place when he can to change the belts and cam phase sensor, i have washed my hands with attempting this.

The connector for the cam sensor is the blue one stan, i presume it was connected correct as the lock pin fitted around it and it then would not pull off, like i said JBT also disconnected and then re connected it so i dont think its the connection.

proccy its not the price of the sensor, its the effort to change it, the cam belt and pully needs removing to get to the sensor. New belt to go on at the same time.

That is bloody unlucky Niff, especially since you'd heard the engine running before fitting it!

Congrats for sticking with it though and not reaching for a gallon of petrol and the Zippo!

ha ha, i was looking for the tow rope to hang myself.

Do you think it is worth me taking the blue connector off and giving it a spray with electrical contact cleaner, also maybe giving it a wiggle whilst someone try's to start the engine to make sure its contacting between the plug and socket.

also is it possible to fit this plug and the securing pin without it actually being connected correct.

I know im clutching at straws and i dont doubt jonnybravoturbo's ability at all but could it possibly just be a bad connection between the plug and socket

Yes, I'd clean the contacts on both sides of the plug/socket just in case it got dirty during the swap. Just needs a tiny speck of debris in there and it could cause a problem. Could also be the wiring from the sensor was damaged when they removed the engine (now I'm clutching at straws, but sometimes even a straw works!)Another thought: remove rocker cover and spray clean the sensor from the engine side, just in case debris is interfering with it, again just clutching at straws......

It's such a stupid design where they've located such a sensitive sensor!

cheers stan, JBT cleaned the sensor last night via the rocker cover, but we did not try to clean the plug or socket thow.

Ill try this either later or tomorrow but it will be the last thing i try, it can go down to JBT if i dont get it running.

That's what happened with knock sensor No.1. on my engine: looked right, felt right, but wasn't quite just there. Pulled it off, thankfully I have long arms and got it from underneath, only lost one pint of blood as I recall, and then plugged it back in using a long lever to make sure it was fully home. That did the trick!

Like you say, still clutching at straws but it's so hard to understand why sensor would fail, after all my engine travelled all the way from Joe's to Cumbria, was then hauled around the garage, manhandled, then lifted back into place, all without any issues

cheers stan, i can also reach the sensor as im very skinny, with long arms, i may have a look at this later and let you know, i cant understand why it has failed, its only been moved around 30 miles or so and was secured very well.

Also its only been out the car for 2 weeks and has been covered, we have actually not had any rain up my way since i picked the engine up.

Maybe it got contaminated with volcanic ash?

Right it is deffiantly the cam sensor, and to be honest ive just about had enough

Ive had time to think and i have come to the decission ive had enough of the coop, so im getting rid.

After all the money spent and effort, especially with this engine change i really cant afford to pay for it to be fixed and to be honest im also not confindent in changing the belts myself and also the cam sensor.

So its a sad day but im afraid the coop has to go.

Thanks to everyone for there help throughtout this engine change.

Sleep on it niff, don't make a rash decision. You're at the end of a bull's hoof right now but it's not going to get worse.

Ride through it mate

i can understand how you're feeling niff but i've been there too many times - bottom line is, when it's running what can you get to replace the joy it gives?

Give it a few days to calm down dude,i know its the worst sensor physically possible to play up but we will get there in the end.
Stick with it.
And don't worry about the money,sort me out with what you can afford and pay the rest when you can.

Thanks guys, i have to say that this forum and its members are brilliant, and johnnybravoturbo has gone above and beyond what any other mechanic would do.

I have kind of calmed down since earlier, i got so wound up because of all the effort with the engine change, and before i began the change the place i got the engine from said i was not allowed to change the cambelts as this would void the warrenty they gave, which turns out it was not worth the paper it was wrote on.

It was suggested i changed the belts and cam sensor before fitting the engine and i would have done this if it would have not void the warrenty.

Ill have i good think and decide what to do,

Thanks all again.

well ive calmed down alot from yesterday and had a good think today.

To be honest if i get rid of the coop the money ill get for her wont really get me a decent car, also apart from this cam sensor problem everything else is spot on mechanically wise, still got 11 months m.o.t.

I really love drivin her and i think i would regret it if i sold or broke her, also it could take some time to do either of these and i really do need the use of a car.

I love these cars so much because they are different, not many around my way and most folk knock around in the chaved up saxo's (each to there own). I love the feeling i get just driving her the short distance to the shop, and also to me the interior is also a special place to be.

So it looks like ill be getting her fixed, hopefully johnybravoturbo can sqeeze me in or maybe get her in if he has any cancelations.

And hopefully once she is all sorted ill get the love back.

I have put so much time, effort and money into her and really want to get her as near as perfect as possible.

Still a long way to go but hopefully ill get there.( money pending lol )

Attaboy

Now you could change your emoticon sig.....

thats how i still feel mate.

I think the main thing that got me thinking of getting rid was the fact that recently i was put out of work and with me having my own house and its just me,i have alot of bills and payments going out for this.

But i have put a lot into the coop and i dont think the thought of getting rid would have even crossed my mind if it wasnt for me being out of work, but hopefully ill be working again pretty soonish.

I would really miss her if i got rid and would probly have to get another when i could but i know my car and i know whats been done to it so with a new coop it would be unknown, so im going stick with her and hopefully there wont be any major problems, atleast until im back working again.

Good to hear the above news niff

lets just hope nothing else major is wrong with the car, at least until im back working because i think it would be the last straw.

Id be reaching for the petrol can and lighter.

Well when you've burnt yours to cinders, you can buy a lovely well looked after Porto from me mate Good compression, healthy oil pressure, new turbo, clutch and manifold. Soon to have new radiator - nowt left to go wrong mate

oh yes, nothing at all can go wrong with these.......

lol proccy I feel your pain.

Eks, does your coop not need brakes or an exhaust? I want myself one of those

brakes were done couple of months ago, exhaust is custom st/st so hope that doesn't need doing

nowt ever goes wrong Steve . oh wait, the old 16vt I had testifies against that...

Lucky!!!!!!!!!!

Someones snapped the bottom cover bolt which fell into the cambelt which jumped the exhaust cam by 7-8 teeth and the inlet by 5-6...


Game over right.....

Put a belt kit on it just out of interest,retimed it and brooooooooom.
First crack of the key.
Quiet as a mouse.

Play the lottery tonight matey.

cheers mate, you are a star, i loved the drive back home and its suprising how much better she sounds, exhaust note wise.

there was nothing wrong with the way my other engine sounded when it was good but this new one seems loads better.

Like i said thanks so much for taking the time to get her in and enjoy your week off mate, see you soon.

So you're driving to Chatsworth now then?!

You need to change that crying face smiley next to your name now too!!

yeah ill be driving as long as all is good coop wise, the smiley is now changed lol.

Excellent, good news

Nice one mate!

Chuffed for you

cheers Eks, you still going to chatsworth, thought i would ask as i can see your getting rid.

great stuff niff and so glad you persevered with her

cheers proccy, as JBT said i was very very lucky that i did not bend a valve with the timing being so far out, all seems good at the moment and the engine seems very strong so fingers crossed.

No worries James,
You wanna post those piccys up of just how far the timing was out.
Unbelieveable.
The exhaust cam was parallel with the head when it should be near vertical.
Great results,and no excuses for missing Chatsworth now buddy

i wont be missing it mate, with or without the coop, but now with.

Ill get those pics up later today.

Should shock a few people

I await the pics with great anticipation mate!

As promised the pics of the timing of my new engine before cambelt change and re time by JBT.
(no bent valves either, lucky [censored]!)

That's a damn good quality picture from your phone dude.

There's no way that engine should be running being that far out.

i was due a stroke of luck (car wise).

I really thought that was it after seeing the timing, as you probly could have noticed.

Lotto is on for tonight mate

Good on you for riding it out

cheers guys, i dont think i would have bothered without the help from johnnybravoturbo, but all seems well at the minute so hopefully ill get many more happy miles from her.

Yes i do recall seeing the ''petrol can and a match'' symbols in your eyes,.

i was gutted mate, although the thought of driving the little yellow fiat about was not such a bad thing lol.

Like you said i think we both expected to have another dead coupe knocking around the side of your garage lol.

nice one niff you lucky devil,not a bad lad that jbt fellow is he hope to see a smile on you face next time i see you

there will be a big smile matey, and yeah jbt saved this one.

O the joys of coop ownership !

Since having my new engine fitted ive been watching for leaks like a hawk.

Anyway i noticed she was using a fair amount of coolant so the investigating began.

Ive not had much luck recently bar the timing issue with this engine and guess what ? its the coolant hose of death leaking.

Anyway i found that it was leaking from a split where the hose connects to the stat so i managed to cut away a bit of the hose and re fit it, seems to have worked, ill be watching for leaks now constantly as the paranoia has set in lol.

its still leaking a tiny bit

could it not be the residue of the original leak dripping off?

well ive just had the battery out and airbox and checked the pipe over again, tightened them up just a little bit more and im going to go for a drive.

it was not dripping as it was before but when i got my hand around the end of the pipe i was getting coolant on my fingers, but no dripping like before.

I gave the pipes and bits that covered in coolant before a good wipe.

Assuming it was the original, I'd get a new one fitted PDQ.

Obviously, you've made sure that any corrosion on the thermostat stub has been cleaned off?

Top tip for avoiding corrosion on alloy stubs like that: try to get the jubilee clip as close as possible to the end of the stub. That avoids coolant coming into contact with too much of the stub, where it sits trapped under the hose and does its nasty work of eating through the alloy.

stat is only a matter of months old and i made sure i cleaned all the stub ends and pipes before re fitting.

Im going to order a new pipe tomorrow from fiat and fit it as soon as it arraives.

Just been for a drive and it seems to have stopped, i think it was what proccy said, the residue from the origional leak coming out.

Ill be keeping an eye on my temps and also checking the pipe every time i go or have been out in the car, still going to swap the pipe when the new one turns up but for now all seems ok.

An i have always fitted my clips as close as possible to the stub, but cheers for the advice stan its always appreciated.